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Nashville 400 vs. Session 500
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The Steel Guitar Forum
Pedal Steel Archive
Nashville 400 vs. Session 500
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| This topic is 2 pages long: 1 2 This topic was originally posted in this forum: Pedal Steel |
| Author | Topic: Nashville 400 vs. Session 500 |
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Craig Holden Member Posts: 194 |
posted 13 October 1999 06:48 AM
What are the differences? Obviously the 500 is MUCH bigger physically, but what is it's output wattage? Sound differences? More whistles and bells? I hear the onboard phaser is pretty cool... My thing is this--I want 1 combo amp to play through. Not 2 combos, not 2 cabinets with a whole rack of digital amps and Profex's and such, just 1 good amp. I see a lot of guys playing through 2 Nashvilles. Why? Does a person really need 420 watts worth of headroom? I've been playing clubs with my JBL-loaded Twin and it's been doing just fine for me. But, it's all tube, and it is prone to acting up as tube gear tends to do. So I'd like to have a solid-state backup in case my Twin goes south, or we play a show without a sound system where I need gobs of power to be heard. I have a Nashville 400 already, and was thinking of investing in a Miracle Audio mod kit. But, I may be better off with a Hernia 500 anyway. (???) Opinions, please! Craig |
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Rodney Shuffler Member Posts: 593 |
posted 13 October 1999 07:11 AM
I like the Session 500 better. I've heard a side-by-side of the Nash and Session (both with LeMay mods) and the Session is warmer to my ear. The Nash is still harsh in comparison to the Session (provided they both have the mod). Neither one is gonna sound as good as your tube amp anyhow. Even John LeMay can't take ALL the Peavey outta those amps, and it's the Peavey in them that makes them so nasally and sterile sounding. I use a 500 with the mod for now.....when I get the money put together, I'll have another Vibrasonic or maybe a Twin. If anyone has a Super Twin for sale, let me know 'cause I'd buy one of those for steel too. Rod |
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Bill Rowlett Member Posts: 664 |
posted 13 October 1999 07:13 AM
Hi Craig, The Session 500 is a much louder amp than the Nashville 400 despte having only a few more rated watts. I could think of no venue where the one Session 500 would not be enough of an amp to cover you. The downside is that you get more hiss when you are not in a loud environment. The on board distortion is very good, the phasor average. It has a built in D.I. and varible crossover and all the bells and whistles that you would ever want. There is a tone difference between the Session and Nashville amps. The preamp tone circuits are different. I personally thought that the Nashville was smoother, so opinions vary. I personally went to the Nashville from the Session because of the smaller size, better tone and quieter operation. I used two Nashville's because I wanted stereo and more volume. I do miss the extra features (i.e. D. I.) that the Session has.
Bill [This message was edited by Bill Rowlett on 10-13-99] |
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Craig Holden Member Posts: 194 |
posted 13 October 1999 07:32 AM
What does the variable crossover do? |
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Mike Brown Member Posts: 3373 |
posted 13 October 1999 08:58 AM
Craig, the crossover is for bi-amping, where you separate the high frequencies from the low frequencies by selecting the crossover frequency. This results in cleaner, clearer separation of frequencies. I don't suspect that many players use this feature, but who knows, it might catch on if a player has an extra power amp and 10" or 12" speaker cabinet, or even a powered 210 cab. As a matter of fact, this would eliminate the need for two amps in some cases. However, some players just prefer the "fullness" of having two amps behind them. If you need more info about this feature, call me at 1-877-732-8391 and we'll discuss. Mike Brown |
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MARK GILES Member Posts: 129 |
posted 13 October 1999 10:00 AM
I have had both the 500 and the 400. Played the 500 for about 15 years.Liked the sound and the DI. The fuzz was not clean enough for me so I used an overdrive stomp box. The phaser was ok. Traded it in on a 400 strictly because of size. I still haven't gotten use to the 400 sound. I don't like it and it already has the mod. If size is not the issue, then go with a 500. Of course, opinions are like .....you know. |
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Rodney Shuffler Member Posts: 593 |
posted 13 October 1999 10:42 AM
Sounds like (at least in certain circles) that Peavey may have a lot of the same problems Fender has.......the ghost of their past haunting them. I, like a lot of folks, have very little interest in new Fender amps; the old ones sound better to my ear. It seems that I've also met a lot of folks who feel the same way about the Session 500 and Nashville 400 amps. I got my Session (not too long ago) in near mint condition for $300.00 and a fellow steeler down the road bought one with a LeMay mod already in it for $375.00. Great amps for that kind of money. Rod
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KEVIN WALKER Member Posts: 208 |
posted 13 October 1999 11:13 AM
I started with a new Vegas 400, kept it two months, and traded for a Session 500. I think all in all, this may be the best steel amp that I've ever played thru'. My Session does not have any kind of modification, and it still sounds good to me, and apparently most other people. A few years back, I decided to buy a back-up. I bought a new Nashville 400. I think I might have used it three or four times. I HATE THAT THING! I think it produces a thin, tinny high end with basically no low end. Even though wattage is not far off from the Sessions' rating, the Nashville has never come close as far as producing any real power without staying in the front of your volume pedal constantly. The Session could've done without both the on-board phaser and distortion, but the three-pin, the headphone out, the bi-amping, and the ability to un-hook the internal speaker easily for quiet practice, in my opinion, made this amp maybe, the best amp that Peavey ever produced. Put it this way: I've never played thru' any other combo amp, that could do it all, like the SESSION 500. Take it for what it's worth! ,Kevin |
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Kenny Dail Member Posts: 2583 |
posted 13 October 1999 01:14 PM
Kevin...and Mike Brown...I agree with what Kevin said. I have been using my present 500 since 1979 or '80. Of course I have had repairs and speakers replaced and baskets replaced. I am presently using a JBL 8 ohm K130. The amp reccomends a 4 ohm load but I just increase the pre and post settins' and keep on picking. Mike you already know how much I like them.  ------------------
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Michael Johnstone Member Posts: 2535 |
posted 13 October 1999 01:38 PM
At one point,I had a Session 400,a Session 500,AND a Nashville 400.(all unmodified)I used to rotate them night after night in the same joint(and on the road)to get a feel for their similarities and differences.I came to like the Session 400 the best.It had plenty of power,a lot of bottom,an XLR DI,a lot of EQ,and was not too big or too heavy.Don't get me wrong,they all sounded good and PLENTY loud.The main difference was in the mid-range EQ curves and the size and weight.My second choice would be the Nashville 400.It's smaller and the missing low end can be recovered with EQ.The 500 was ok but monsterously big and heavy and all the bells and whistles meant nothing to me 'cause I do all that stuff w/outboard multifex.I finally got rid of the 500 and kept the other two.I still like the Session 400 the best. -MJ- |
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BobG Member Posts: 788 |
posted 13 October 1999 03:44 PM
I played through a Session 500 (no mod) for close to a year and was never happy with the sound quality. I recently picked up a Session 400 and i'm completely satisfied. The highs are crisp and the lows are also there. It's an older model (Ser.#9A433966)with a 15" BW in it. Mike, if you read this and can tell me what year it was made i'd appreciate it. |
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Pete Burak Member Posts: 2750 |
posted 13 October 1999 03:52 PM
I noticed that several folks have both a Session 500 and a Nashville 400. Having both amps, how would you set it up to use the onboard crossover feature of the 500? Is it as simple as running the crossover out to the input of the 400? |
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Jack Stoner Sysop Posts: 8119 |
posted 13 October 1999 05:04 PM
I used a Session 500 for about 16 years. It is a great steel guitar amp. The string (fuzz) section is crap, but the phase shifter is the best one I've heard. As far as the difference, other than the built in effects, the Session also had an XLR (600 ohm) output for DI. I don't remember the power exactly but I believe it was rated at 310 Watts (but may have been 240 the same aa a Nashville 400). The EQ system is identical in both amps. I now have a new Nashville 400, with the factory mod and I run the EQ on it about the same as I did on the Session 500. If you use the "3 cord" hook up, Guitar directly in to the amp and the volume pedal in the effects loop, mine is so close to the 500 that I don't miss the heavy beast. The original Nashville 400's would not come close to the 500, but the newer ones with the tone mod come so close I switched - and I thought then and I still think the Session 500 was the best steel amp Peavey had built (in reference to the Session 400's, and Vegas/Nashville 400). The only negative is the weight of the Session 500, but if you're used to lugging around a Fender Twin you'll feel right at home. I had a Fender Twin (with JBL) and thought when I bought the Session 500 with the solid state it would be lighter. HA!
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Dennis Detweiler Member Posts: 1700 |
posted 13 October 1999 07:41 PM
Bob The 9A = 1979 I tried a Session 500 for a few weekends several years ago and thought it was a little thinner in the low mid to mid range. I have also tried a Nashville 400 last year when my Session 400s were in the shop. I still prefer the tone of my 74 and 76 Session 400s. DD |
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Earnest Bovine Member Posts: 4687 |
posted 13 October 1999 09:44 PM
I didn't like the sound of the Session 500. It didn't seem as loud as my Session 400 or Nashville or Vegas. So I got rid of the Session 500. The Vegas 400 is my favorite of the bunch. |
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Chuck Smith Member Posts: 85 |
posted 14 October 1999 09:43 AM
I had an old Session 500 and liked the sound just fine, thought I needed the newer Nash 400 so I got one. Sold the 500 and played thru the 400. The sound was not near as good as the 500 to my ear. I bought another 500. Both the 400 and 500 have Lemay mods. Played them side by side,one at a time on a couple of gigs where I was used to the sound. That old Session 500 that needs two men and a mule to tote around wins hands down... I am going to keep the 500 this time and sell the Nash 400, which sounds good, until you play them side by side. I guess sooner or later you learn. -) ------------------ |
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Don Sulesky Member Posts: 1126 |
posted 15 October 1999 06:41 AM
I sold my 500 last year and at the same time got rid of my back brace. It had a great sound, but I love my new 400 and don't miss the 30lbs. Don |
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Mike Brown Member Posts: 3373 |
posted 15 October 1999 11:41 AM
Man, does this prove a point or what????????? We all have different tastes. Some like the Vegas, some dislike the Vegas, some like the Peavey "enhanced" Nashville 400, some like the Nashville as it was originally, etc.. If we(Peavey) don't experiment with different EQ's, distortions or effects in general, we don't know what the endless possiblities are! Hence, the new Nashville 1000 amplifier and the new forthcoming Session 2000 amp, which has endless possibilities. We(Peavey Electronics) appreciate your support and will continue to offer the latest amplifier technology at prices that you can afford.Has anybody reasoned why some of these other amps cost so much? Thanks for the comments(pro or con) about our products. We will continue to support the steel guitar market. Oh yes, Bob G. That serial number is from 1979 unit. [This message was edited by Mike Brown on 10-15-99] |
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Craig Holden Member Posts: 194 |
posted 15 October 1999 12:06 PM
Thanks to everybody for their $.02. I reckon I'll hang on to the 'ol Nashville, and one of these days if I run into a fellow steeler who has a 500, I'll A/B the two to hear for myself. As I say, the Twin is my amp of preference right now, but a good old hard-workin' Peavy waiting on standby isn't a bad thing to have around when the tube rig decides to short out and blow all the power tubes...... Craig |
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Eddie K Member Posts: 120 |
posted 15 October 1999 02:28 PM
Mike, ____________________________________________ Has anybody reasoned why some of these other amps cost so much? The steel guitar community is not the place to be anti Peavey. My experiences have been that Peavey Electronics have some of the most innovative engineers in the business. They've always produced gear with useful features that no one else had and a lot of times at a substantial cost savings. I've purchased a lot of Peavey gear because of these reasons. I wound up selling these items since they didn't live up to my expectations. I moved on to the more expensive gear and found more satisfying tone, performance and dependability but do miss some of the features that the Peavey gear had. I expect a full bashing from the Peavey crowd but would absolutely love to buy Peavey features with the tone and dependability I've found on the higher end gear. Even at a much higher cost. Sorry guys ------------------
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BILL McCUMBER Member Posts: 8 |
posted 16 October 1999 06:58 PM
I bought a session 400 back in the late 70's and it was OK. Then I bought one of the first session 500 and really did like it. However I played though several other 500s and they did not sound as good as mine. Let me share this with you guys. I took one of my 2 session 400 and replaced the baffel with 1/2 9 ply plywood and installed and Evans speaker as set both side by side and I ask my wife to tell me which amp sounded the best (she did not know what I had done). She picked the 1/2 plywood and Evans speaker right away. I then took both amps to a steel picker, piano tuner and compaired and he picked the same as my wife. The 1/2 plywood with the Evans speaker has so much more warmth than the other 400 that I changed out the other amp to the same mod. ------------------ |
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hank R Member Posts: 95 |
posted 18 October 1999 02:34 PM
I think if Peavey were the first on the block to make a steel amp with a tube preamp circuit like the old Evans(Evans says they won't) Now, we have an amp that would shake the stel amp industry (as small as it is)with innovation. Why cant steel tones , be as warm as the standard guitar players in a live situation. I realize it is opinion , however you would unite the tube vs. solid st. hmmmm . That would be like dreaming of an accumulative customer base ready to multiply . Who knows even guitarists would purchase it. Call it the NASHVILLE 400 TUBEX. Good for coughs too. |
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Jack Stoner Sysop Posts: 8119 |
posted 18 October 1999 04:06 PM
Hank R, two things. One I don't want to sound like the guitar player. Two, as an electonics tech (and a steel picker) I can't see why anyone would still want archaic technology (tubes). The mystique that surrounds tubes dumbfounds me, with the current solid state technology available today. I defy a steel picker to take a Tubefex and a Transtube Fex blindfold test and tell which is which. |
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Ques Gibbs Member Posts: 12 |
posted 23 October 1999 12:21 PM
I have a session 500 in an Anvil flite case and the weight is terrible but the thing has more power and guts than anything I have ever seen. You would be surprised at the people that have tried to buy it....Not for sale.....It's just too damn good..... |
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Steve Allison Member Posts: 396 |
posted 24 October 1999 05:33 AM
I've been playin' a 500 every weekend for the past 20 yrs. or so and it's only been in the shop once when the xformer bit the dust because the power went out & came back on real quick. I always want to try something different to see if i can get that "magical" tone but, if you look around you will see that there are many players who sound great through almost any amp. When you have that "love affair" with your steel it will show up through your heart to your hands.Just make sure you give your "lover" enough power to respond to your style. The 500 has got it. |
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Danny Hullihen Member Posts: 1782 |
posted 24 October 1999 06:30 AM
Jack Stoner. Amen brother. Rodney. Shame on ya! After reading your post, I'm amazed that you would allow yourself to be caught anywhere near a Peavey amp, let alone use one, however "temporary." |
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Rodney Shuffler Member Posts: 593 |
posted 24 October 1999 09:54 AM
Maybe you should read BOTH of my posts Danny. I sure didn't mean to hurt yer lil' ol' feelins. I didn't say I don't like the Session 500, I just like the tube amps better. I would RATHER have a Fender, but I ain't gonna let a jagged P on my amp stop me from playin' steel and havin' fun at it. Rod |
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Mike Brown Member Posts: 3373 |
posted 27 October 1999 07:00 AM
We "will" use this feedback from you guys and gals for future reference. Keep it coming! Your input is valuble. |
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KEVIN WALKER Member Posts: 208 |
posted 28 October 1999 12:14 AM
Mike Brown, Here's an idea for you. How about a limited edition Mark IV series SESSION 500? Scrap the string effect, scrap the phase shifter, build the chassis and cabinet exactly like the early models. KEEP EVERY OTHER ON-BOARD FEATURE. I guarantee I'd be the first to buy a re-issue. ,Kevin |
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John Lacey Member Posts: 1843 |
posted 28 October 1999 09:50 AM
Mike, does the Nashville 1000/Session 2000 sound close to an Evans or Webb? To me these are about the best steel guitar amps available, just a little too pricey. |
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J D Sauser Member Posts: 1240 |
posted 28 October 1999 08:08 PM
I've had three Nashville 400's and one Session 500. My Nashville's were all bought new on 1993, 1995 and 1999. the last one came with the Peavey mod. They all sounded different, completely different. As a matter of fact, the first one was the only one I liked. Now, I sold all my Nashville's and the Session and gone back to tubes, but that's an other story. But there's a guy, about 6o miles South of me (yeah..., very important information here !), that has a Nashville he's bought in the mid eighties. No mod. This thing sounds absolutely incredible! He had a Webb amp too, he sold it over that Nashville, just so you can imagine how good that Nashville sounds. I tell you, it's so good, that even though I consider my self as "hooked" on tubes, I would buy that thing from him anytime at the "new" price.So, when Craig Holden asks about Nashville vs. Session's, and all respond, how much they like one over an other..., I respectfully suggest, that this discrepancy of opinions may at least be equally related to the inconsitancy in sound of these amps (among same models) as the wide variety of tastes... And I think that this is not only a Peavey specific phenomena, it applies to Fender too and speakers and, and, and.... So, in other words; you don't like "your" Nashville or Session? Hey, you just might like an other one  .... J-D. |
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Ron Banks Member Posts: 3 |
posted 29 October 1999 09:06 PM
I have used both the 400 & 500 and agree with a previous replier that the difference in power is greater than the specs would suggest. You just wouldn't want to be near a more powerful amp!! I didn't care for the effects but the clean tone was great. My old 500 is now for sale at Retro Music (603) 357-9732 (NH). It's in great shape and has casters and cabinet side handles installed. Those make it more manageable. |
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Mike Brown Member Posts: 3373 |
posted 02 November 1999 08:56 AM
I'd like to address all of the questions and comments one at a time, whether they are "pro" or "con" comments. I've never personally sat down and A/B'd these two particular amps, but I have played the Nashville 400 since 1985 and am now playing the Session 500 to get a feel for it. There is definitely a different feel between the two. We appreciate your support of our steel amps and constantly search for new ideas for our products and this forum is a vital key in providing that type of info for future products. As you have discussed here in this post, everyone favors certain tonalities and voicings for their preference in amps. Tastes change just as in a preference of music, cars, etc., so that's the reason some features on our amps have changed also...... that's what the consumer prefers at the time. It's that elusive tone that everyone is seeking. As you have also found out, we are not afraid to try something different with our products. Case in point is the Nashville 1000 amplifier. I have played this amp on a gig for the past 3 weekends. Bottom line is: In this post, there have been comments from "love to buy Peavey features........even at a much higher price" to "Evans or Webb......are just a little to pricey". Well, the Session 2000 is coming. It has the equalization curves that allow the amp to emulate the sound of an Evans, Webb, Session 400, Session 400 Limited and the Nashville 400. One pro player recently heard the Webb preset and commented, "you nailed that one". Again, thanks for your support and comments. Call me Monday through Thursday from 8am to 5:30pm CST for more info. |
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ollie strong Member Posts: 24 |
posted 06 November 1999 09:45 AM
I had a 500, and agree it was too heavy, so made a box to hold the head {the reverb unit fit in very well}, and another box for the speaker, at the same time added a very small tone control in the reverb line, that helped smooth out the reverb sound to my personel taste. To my ear it was a better amp and I only had to make one more trip to the car. |
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ken collins Member Posts: 102 |
posted 07 November 1999 09:40 AM
I find a real difference in sound in the Nashville 400 depending on the speaker. I wish Mike B. would explain. The older amps were fitted with a 1502, then later a 1501. I much prefer the 1502. The 1501 to me has that thin, nasally sound although it has more lows. Myself, I cut the lows back even with the 1502 on stage because even tho alot of low end sounds good on stage I believe the crowd gets a lot of roar. I also believe the not so good sound comes mostly from the guitars. I still hear p/p and a 500 in my head but can't get it with other equipment. Thanks, Ken Collins ------------------ |
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T MOONEY unregistered Posts: 102 |
posted 10 November 1999 06:54 PM
Seems that the main objection to the '500 is it's weight. I solved that problem with mine by putting the 'tronics in a separate cabinet, made up to match the Peavey cabinet, hardware and all. The speaker stayed as is, and the rest is the "head". This cuts the weight of each piece about 40/50# instead of 85#. It has the added advantage of giving you the option of having the head where it's convenient to use, and the speaker somewhere else. Plus, I think a lot of amp problems result from fractured solder connections in the power amp and other sections due to constant vibration from the speaker. Problem solved, if this is what's happening. Pictures on request. Tom Mooney Mooney Guitar Co. |
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T MOONEY unregistered Posts: 102 |
posted 10 November 1999 06:55 PM
Seems that the main objection to the '500 is it's weight. I solved that problem with mine by putting the 'tronics in a separate cabinet, made up to match the Peavey cabinet, hardware and all. The speaker stayed as is, and the rest is the "head". This cuts the weight of each piece about 40/50# instead of 85#. It has the added advantage of giving you the option of having the head where it's convenient to use, and the speaker somewhere else. Plus, I think a lot of amp problems result from fractured solder connections in the power amp and other sections due to constant vibration from the speaker. Problem solved, if this is what's happening. Pictures on request. Tom Mooney Mooney Guitar Co. |
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Mike Taylor Member Posts: 64 |
posted 12 November 1999 04:44 PM
I have a well worn Session 400 (serial number 8A-210267 - 1978 date of mfg ?). It's been used for both guitar and steel. As a guitar player, I always liked the real clean sound of the Sessions ; especially the old Session LTD 400. They had a much different sound than the bigger Sessions. Don't see them or hear too much about them! I felt they were better than the early Nashville's.. - Mike |
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C Allen Member Posts: 441 |
posted 12 November 1999 08:17 PM
A few years ago I was in need of an amp. I went to my local Peavey dealer, and came away with an amp I'm sure the dealer thought he was dumping on me. A Session LTD Wedge. That was the best amp I have ever owned, and I've owned quite a few great amps. Mike Brown, I want another one!!!!!!!!!!! If anyone has one, I would trade a Brand New Nashville 400, with "enhancement" for it.... ------------------ |
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Al Marcus Member Posts: 7471 |
posted 14 November 1999 07:50 PM
To Mike Brown.- To me , after reading all these good posts, I have concluded that the two biggest problems between the two is Power-Volume and Weight. It appears that they both have several good charitaristics. So for me Mike, Give me a 500, 400, 1000, 2000 that weighs 40 lbs, or put them in two pieces , one with the electronics and one with the speaker only. As Tom Mooney has suggested. This way less breakdowns as the speaker does not shake the Electronics, and for the player, he can be balanced with both hands in carrying them....al..How about it? |
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