posted 09 June 2000 08:21 AM         

A standard guitar has to deal with the force of pressing the string down against an immovable fret. Different string gauges react differently to this pressure, which is why there is an adjustment for each string. The downward force of the bar on a steel guitar doesn't bend the string over an immovable fret, and the force is much smaller.

Try adjusting your standard guitar for bottleneck playing, and you'll see what I mean. Your bridge ends up in a stright line. You only have the intonation problem when you start pushing the strings down to the immovable frets.

Plus, if there were one more thing to adjust on my steel guitar, I'd never have a chance of getting it in tune!

posted 10 June 2000 06:42 AM         

Pushing a string down doesn't create the intonation problem, but it does make it worse. Even pianos, whose strings are neither pulled nor pushed, exhibit the intonation problem. This is why good piano tuners make $60 an hour, and can't use electric tuners.

posted 10 June 2000 10:46 AM         

Very respectfully, how can a piano have an intonation problem? Is it possible you are speaking of Just Intonation Tuning vs Equal Temperament Tuning rather than intonation?

My understanding of intonation problems on a regular guitar is the same as b0bby Lee's.

take care,

posted 16 June 2000 09:21 AM         

You are correct. But Intonation is not this. Intonation is caused by one or more strings on a fretted instrument NOT being the same length as other srings on that same instrument. And this is caused by the finger stretching the string (when it is fretted), on a regular guitar.

What you are talking about on a piano, most all musical instruments suffer from and that is in the 12 note semitone scale that we use, it is impossible to tune the "beats" out of every conceivable chord that can be created. A compromise is necessary.

Here is a prime and classic example:

The following tuning was used by many western swing greats for years:

E
C#
B
G#
F#
E
D
B

There is NO way to tune all 8 of the strings so that there is NO beat between some of them. NO way. It is the problem of our modern music.

That is why greats like Bill Stafford, Buddy Emmons, Weldon Myrick and I am told Sonny Garrrish now tune straight up to 440 reference on all strings, pedals and knee levers.

I cannot stand this form of tuning (equal temperament), but when Bill, Buddy, Weldon play, they sound perfectly in tune to my ears. Yet when I tune as they do, I sound terrible to my ears.

Go figure

God bless you always,

carl

[This message was edited by C Dixon on 16 June 2000 at 09:22 AM.]

posted 30 June 2000 10:49 PM         

I don't believe this is exactly true. This would not account for the fact that as guitar strings age, the intonation problem gets worse. If you try to set your bridge on a standard guitar using a very old set of strings you may even run out of adjustment before you achieve the desired effect.

If all you were trying to do was adjust the "stretching" out, this could be done at the factory and there wouldn't be any need for any adjustments.

I was always told that the intonation on a guitar had to adjustable to account for minute imperfections (out of roundness, etc.)in a string causing it to vibrate in a less than perfect manor. Therefore, you needed to actually change the length of the string in order to set the harmonic center to match the fretted center (12th fret).

Oh well, that's my two cents, anyway,