Paul Franklin, Sonny Garrish, Bruce Bouton and a precious few others can make a (very) decent living without having to leave town at the drop of a hat. I'd assume that players like Gary Morse, Jeff Peterson, (oops, I almost forgot Ricky) and others who are associated with a popular recording artist do ok too.

Then you have the 'everybody else' -- and there's a bunch. Competition is fierce -- Herby Wallace just mentioned at the Michigan show that he was turned down for a regular gig near Chattanooga (Dollywood?) because all he plays is steel. THAT SUCKS. Herby could play in ANYBODY'S band. If he has trouble finding a gig, where does that rank the rest of the steel playing world? (I hope Herby doesn't mind my saying this, since he did mention this ridiculous state of affairs in public)

All-in-all, most of what I hear from folks who choose to try to support themselves playing steel is that they have a tough time of it and often end up with day jobs to supplement their picking money. Many I know play several instruments and are willing to go on the road playing rhythm guitar if that's what's called for.

I don't think this thread is going to give you any numbers or percentages to go on, since most steel players are not Forum participants. But it's a pretty safe assumption that a VERY small fraction of one percent of steel players are making the lion's share of the money.

I average a couple of gigs a week, in addition to a full time career outside the music business. I know people trying to make a living at it who don't play much more often than that. It's a tough row to hoe. At an average pay of $50 or so a night, one would have to play 1,000 gigs/year to make $50K, so most bar gigs would be out of the question -- unless you worked 3 gigs/day every day of the year. (whew!!!)

MY HAT IS OFF TO THOSE WHO CAN SUCCESSFULLY NEGOTIATE A CAREER AS A STEEL PLAYER THESE DAYS.

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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Emmons D-10 9x9, 1971 Dobro

[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 29 April 2002 at 12:02 PM.]

said they were looking for "utility players", multi instrumentalists, jacks-of-all-trades-masters-of-a-couple

more power to them and anyone who's got a gig playing ANY steel, much less supporting themselfs..

[This message was edited by Dave Van Allen on 29 April 2002 at 12:09 PM.]

One of the problems of playing the steel guitar for a living, unless you have a band of your own, is that you have to hook up with one or several bands. Sometimes it's very difficult to find a band with similar tastes and personal excesses (or lack thereof). Sometimes you have to juggle schedules with multiple bands.

If you do real concerts with bands--like where people play to hear you and sit down in seats or crowd a stadium--you might be required to play the record licks. I think that's one of the lamest requests to make of a musician. If you're lucky and/or selective like I was, then you get to play what you feel. When I joined Hoyt Axton's band in 1976, he told me, "When your solo comes up, I don't care what you do, just as long as you 'get the audience off.' That's your job."

Hoyt was great. He even rescheduled part of a tour, so that I could tour Japan with Guy Clark.

Conversely, in a band rehearsal, I helped a young lady--whose name you'd recognize--arrange her first album. She went to Nashville and recorded it. The next rehearsal, the manager showed up with a tape and said to the band, "I want you to learn these tunes note-for-note." They were far from classic licks, just Sears and Roebuck stuff. I called the manager aside and said, "I'm sorry. If you want someone to play someone else's licks, you've got the wrong person."

He said, "No, Pete. If you make this sacrifice, you can all play on the next album. We had to do this one in Nashville for political reasons. We want the band to have a unique sound and you to be part of it." I politely declined. By the third album, the bandleader, a brilliant lead guitarist and arranger, got to play rhythm guitar on ONE tune. No-one else recorded a peep.

All that having been said, I say, "Be committed!" It's a wonderful instrument that gives people joy. Do it on your own terms. You don't have to be a professional, but approach it like a pro. Do you want to sound like a pro or a dabbler? Carve out practice time. Take it away from your TV time. If you have a lawn to mow and no teenager in the household to do it, pay some kid to do it and spend the time sitting down with a good lesson tape or Band in a Box. Play with friends. Form a band. Get good. Get competent. The world needs more steel guitarists!

Go for it.

Pete Grant
www.petegrant.com

[This message was edited by Pete Grant on 29 April 2002 at 12:31 PM.]

I play steel, dobro, and mandolin.

Sometimes I tour with bands and play any or all of the three.

Sometimes I play and/or record with local bands and teach all three instruments at a local music store or here at the house.

Sometimes I'm busy, and I wouldn't change what I do for anything.

Sometimes I'm not so busy, and the gravy gets a little thin, and I think of hanging it all up and gettin' me a good job somewhere...then the phone rings with another gig/student/session/tour/jam and I start getting excited all over again.

Fortunately, my life-style doesn't require a lot of money, but I make enough to support my life-style

Some make a conscious decision, educate themselves, make a plan and go from there; others are thrown into circumstances beyond their control and decide to do the best they can with what they were dealt. Best of luck to you, whatever you decide to do.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't think I could handle a job where someone was constantly telling me exactly what to play. The main reason I don't go to concerts anymore is that the star's musicians are so restricted, there's almost nothing significant (instrumentally, anyway) to listen to. (Today, it's all about the "STAR"). Anyway, if I want to hear it played "exactly like the CD", I'll buy the damn CD...and save the $30-$50 more the concert tickets would have cost! (I'm well past being a teenager, so all those fireworks, laser-light shows, and 40-thousand watt audio systems don't impress me none!

I also don't get this "utility player" thing. Most of the audience that attends these big concerts (probably 70-80%) wouldn't know an "E" note from a ransom note. They're there to see that "star" and all the attendant bullcrap spectacle. As long as there's a loud drummer, a throbbing bass, and a distorted lead guitar, they could care less about the steel, keyboard, or rhythm player not being there. But, I digress...

Especially irksome is when the bashers are weekend warriors with lifetime day gigs... or worse yet, living room pickers... who never had the talent or cojones to get out in the trenches, get on the bus, and go do what it takes to earn money as a full-time professional steel player.

No one is a more traditional steel player than Jim Loessberg or myself. We both have done other things but the majority of our working lives have been spent as steel guitarists. We were talking the other day, and I asked Jim if he'd take a gig with a "Hot New Country" act.

"In a New York minute, hoss," he replied.

"Me too" was my answer.

I gave up picking for a long time, not because it wasn't totally fun (which it wasn't), but because I had ceased to recognize the fact that playing was in my blood and I HAD to do it... there was no choice in the matter.

You either HAVE to gig or you don't. And sometimes following the money is what work is about, whether you're an accountant, a tool and die maker, or a musician.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

[This message was edited by Herb Steiner on 29 April 2002 at 07:26 PM.]

At that stage in life I was making a living and loving it. Music financed my long term goals and schooling and was there to make ends meet while I established myself in my career. I don't ever plan to go back to full time playing but enjoy the memories.

Although I consider myself somewhat creative and talented, I don't think that I posess the "drive" required of a sucsessful player. I did keep my gear and still enjoy playing-out casually and get an occasional studio gig though.

To all that do continue to play for a living, my hat is off to you and I wish you the best. Where would our new licks come from without you?

Gerald,
One thing is that as my skills develope and I am able to deal with more musical situations the money seems to get better.

Hang in there. You are doing great !

I've been a "weekend warrior" for many years. The availability of gigs and my commitment to my day job created a situation where I went to work every weekday morning and most weeknights I rehearsed or "played out" with a band. Usually, the Friday and/or Saturday nights provided a gig opportunity. This probably is a common scenario for a lot of us on the forum. At one point, I was a member (not a "hired gun") in a atl. rock band as well as a top-40 country band at the same time. It kept me busy and I was happy with that situation.

For the last 4 years, I've been a member of the Kevin Fowler Band. The last 24 months or so, the KFB has supported all the band members plus the road manager, bus driver, merchandiser, manager/booking agent as well as the band infrastructure. When I say support I mean this is the sole income.

I am still committed to my day job. I believe I have something to contribute to that as well as to the music. I am the only one in the band organization in this situation. For me, the sacrifice is not so much a monetary one, but one of time and I am humbled by the support I get from my wife and son. They pay the price for my frequent absenses at home.

I will continue to "double-dip" as long as my family tolerates the situation or my stamina holds out. Which, I hope, will be a long time.

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn

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MAL MSA S-10 3 & 4 Es335 Gibson-Martin d-41 Fenter 62 Jaguar. Roland Keyboard 3stack,Fiddle ,Mandolin, and Swinette

Years ago, some bands cut their own stuff without the star. A lot of people just went to the shows to see the band (imagine that!) Some shows I've been to, the stars don't feature the band. Heck, some of 'em don't even introduce the band! Guess I've always thought that the lowly musicians got the short end of the stick. It's just that it seems worse in the past decade or so. (I posed a question about steel intro's in top-10 hits a while back...I can't recall any in the last 10 years.)

The music business just doesn't seem the same anymore, and I will admit that I'm probably not, either. Today, it's all money...there just doesn't seem to be the friendly (almost family) regard that the stars used to have for their musicians...they're all just "hired hands" now, "subcontractors" as it were. And if somebody comes along that can play steel and another instrument---buddy, you're gone! I just don't think it should be that way...but maybe I'm alone on this.

I guess what really frosted my asterior was when I read awhile back that a certain female "country singer" spends $5,000 per show for her hairdresser!!! (I seriously doubt that her entire band put together makes that much per show, but if I'm wrong...I'm sure some will tell me.) Now maybe that sort of thing doesn't bother most people, and maybe I'm the only one who gets upset at that kind of stuff...could very well be.

But of course, if all these road musicians are totally fat, dumb, and happy with their salary and station, I guess maybe I should keep my big mouth shut.

Excuse me for being concerned.

That great intimacy is gone. Everything today, to me, seems like RUSH, RUSH, RUSH.
This notion is not new. We've been hearing of this anti-civil demeanor for many years now. But it seems that the 'protected art community' was sort of a great and necessary haven for anyone and everyone who wanted more from life than the ratrace. In other words, a genuine compradrieness. A sense of some common bond that was more powerful than any nuclear family could ever hope to provide. Not every family now or then even came close to Beaver, Wally, June, or Ward.

There just aren't the old venues anymore. The joint down the street. The coffeehouse.
Someone's old barn.

I mean, by the joints, oh yeah, they may still be there, but that relaxed, laidback
personna is not there. These places, as soon as they open there doors for business, then, they are there for business.

If you and friends are taking up precious seats, and playing music for free, and having a great time to boot..........yup...years ago, this was not only tolerated, but encouraged.

But, the new venue folks see it another way.

I hope you folks get my drift, here. (I'm beginning to get to the ramblin' stage) so I feel I should cut it off, for now.

Thanks y'all, and Donny, once agaqin.

[This message was edited by CHIP FOSSA on 30 April 2002 at 08:28 PM.]

I started my first day job 9/5/95 (notice how I remember that exact date.)

I went to "weekend warrior" status in '91 when I decided to follow through on that college thing I told the folks about back in '81.

I decided to go back to college because at about age 27 I was playing with a band leader who was about 10 or so years older than me, and it was like a window into my future, and it wasn't pretty.
Drinking, drugs, failed marrige, rehabs, beligerance on stage, ect...

Got an Electronics degree and a gig at Intel.

After relocating to Portland, Oregon for work, I got right back into a band.

We released a CD and toured in Europe 3 times in the 18 months following the CD release, and opened up for Willie, Merle, and many others locally.

The band just released their 2nd CD which I played on 11 of 12 songs.

Although I recently left the band for and "indefinate leave of absence" due to general burn out with the band member scene, I am now embarking on a solo career and plan to play alot of solo steel gigs (and duo gigs with some local pickers including Ray Montee) this summer to get the bugs worked out.

I really couldn't have done any of this without the day job, which has finacially fueled all of my musical endeavors.

It allowed me to focus on things that I was actually interested in musically vs. having to play to pay the bills.

I had an extremely fun, Fun (with a capitol F) time those first 10 years, traveling around the Rocky Mt region playing steel and guitar.
I always made enough to pay the bills but never saved a dime in those years.

So having been on both sides of the fence, I gotta say that I feel I haven't compromised my musical endeavors at all by going with the day job, and in fact, have gotten way closer to doing what I want to do musically (and have no problem passing on potential paying gigs that just don't turn my crank musically.).

My reccomendation to anyone who asks is... go to your local community college's financial aid office where they will help you get all the grants and loans you will need. Get at least a 2 year degree in something you are interested in (they will help you find out what you are naturally good at), and play weekends while you go to class during the week.

Most employers highly value their trained employees and will bend over backwards to give you the flexibilty you need, (to go tour europe for 2 weeks, for example).

For me, It's a way to Survive.

ps
The High Tech industry is at the beginning of it's next up-swing and will be in "hiring mode", so get them resume's into your local High Tech companys (you can apply online), Intel, AMD, Motorola, IBM, ect...