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Author
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Topic: bar slant question . .
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Joel Newman
Member From: Myersville, Maryland, USA
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posted 21 December 2004 08:37 AM
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ok, so I'm just starting to learn how to slant and I think I'm getting the higher string up a 1/2 step from the lower, (tip of bar turning to the right), but I can't for the life of me fathom how you guys do the other way without losing the bar altogether. Do you turn your elbow in towards your body? I'm flumaxed . . .any help would be mucho appreciado,
Tanx,
Joel Newman |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Austin, Texas
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posted 21 December 2004 09:12 AM
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Hi Joel; here is a link to your specific question, that I fielded some years back about practicing bar slant technique>
http://www.mightyfinemusic.com/topics/practiceslants.htm
This comes from my Question and Answer tips page Here> http://www.mightyfinemusic.com/q&a.htm
I hope this helps you some.
Ricky |
Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 21 December 2004 09:12 AM
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All you need is a bar with the butt end carved out. Stick your thumb in there and give it a twist. No big deal. 
Erv[This message was edited by Erv Niehaus on 21 December 2004 at 09:12 AM.] |
Patrick Newbery
Member From: San Francisco, California, USA
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posted 21 December 2004 09:24 AM
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It should be accomplished mostly by shifting the bar with the fingers and thumb, rather than with the wrist. Using your wrists to do slants will lead to some painful repetitve strain-type pain. It's hard to do at first but practice, practice, practice and it will begin to become second nature. |
Rick Collins
Member From: Claremont , CA USA
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posted 21 December 2004 10:12 AM
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Be sure to keep your index finger arched up on top of the bar and as they have said, use your thumb on the butt end to move it right or left. |
Ron Whitfield
Member From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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posted 21 December 2004 10:33 AM
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Joel, as per Jerry Byrd, you'll want to keep your elbows in at all times, as well as your wrists slightly up, as most of the work is done by the hands above the wrists.The way you hold the bar will determine the way you work it. Try to keep the tip of your left index finger resting on top of and towards the bullet end of the bar, middle/ring/pinkie fingers resting along the left side, and thumb near the bottom right end of the bar (length of bar, 2 & 3/4") and be ready at all times to casually dip the tip of your thumb into the end of the bar to start a reverse turn. This will give you the basic hand positioning in which to optimize your future abilities. You'll find out much more info using the 'search' option provided on the SGF. Have fun! |
Ray Minich
Member From: Limestone, New York, USA
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posted 21 December 2004 10:50 AM
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It's a wrist breaker 'till ya figure it out. |
Dwayne Martineau
Member From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
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posted 21 December 2004 01:30 PM
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I was hurting myself slanting until I bought the Jerry Byrd video. Turns out it's much easier and requires WAY less effort than you'd expect.The only effort was packing my bar around in my pocket every day for a month, practicing slants on my desk for hours at a time. quote:
Be sure to keep your index finger arched up on top of the bar
--that's the most important thing. If you're finger is flat on the bar, you'd better start doing your carpal tunnel stretches.
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Joel Newman
Member From: Myersville, Maryland, USA
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posted 21 December 2004 08:40 PM
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Thanks Gents! Guess I have some practicing to do . . . . |
Steve Pierce
Member From: San Rafael, California, USA
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posted 21 December 2004 10:41 PM
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Hello,While we're on the topic of slants, I thought I'd throw one of my problems into the mix. I also have the Byrd video, but I can't get my fingers into the posiitions he demonstrates. When he goes into the forward slant his finger is slightly arched. When I go into the forward slant my finger is very arched. I guess it is because my finger is longer than his. I've always compensated by letting my index finger drift off the front side of the bar and putting my thumb more towards the middle than the back. It gets me into trouble though when I need to quickly alternate slants and straights. Does anyone else with fingers longer than Jerry's have any tips? It's one of those things that I wish I had personal instruction on. Forward slant techniques are difficult to describe in words! Thanks ------------------
Steve Pierce |
Ron Whitfield
Member From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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posted 22 December 2004 10:43 AM
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Jerry's fingers are very compact, and after all these years, permanently formed to certain positions often used. His standard size bar may be too short for some, but over 3 1/2" may prove problematic when slanting.The slanting process is very relaxed and smooth, while under complete control with the least amount of effort, as you want to be able to continue a natural sounding vibrato. In time, it will become automatic. But if you're in pain, stop and re-examine your efforts, as it should be easy and painless to the extreme. Hold the bar exactly as Jerry does, and you can't go wrong, as far as the classic style of steel playing is concerned. Keeping that index finger tip in position is critical to control and movement, and there is rarely a reason to alter from it. Of course, in music, there are no rules. Bob Brozman does 'everything wrong', yet find someone who can't dig his music. |
Dwayne Martineau
Member From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
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posted 22 December 2004 01:36 PM
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If you're moving your thumb up the bar, then a longer bar will only create more problems...The key for me was a loose and relaxed grip. When I got to the point where I had the lightest grip possible, but could still pick the bar up and wave it around without losing it-- that's when I felt I had the right grip.
[This message was edited by Dwayne Martineau on 04 January 2005 at 03:19 PM.] |
John Bechtel
Member From: Nashville, Tennessee,U.S.A.
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posted 22 December 2004 09:13 PM
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For my 8-str. playing I use a ‘John Pearse’ Thermo–Cryonic Hawai'ian Tone-Bar. (3/4”x2 7/8”) I suppose the length you would need would depend a little on long or short fingers!------------------
“Big John” Bechtel
’49/’50 Fender T–8 Custom
’65 Re-issue Fender Twin-Reverb Custom™ 15”
click here click here
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Steve Pierce
Member From: San Rafael, California, USA
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posted 23 December 2004 11:03 AM
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Thanks for the tips!Relaxing is probably the answer. I've got to slow it down and begin again. Merry, Merry ------------------
Steve Pierce |
Dan Sawyer
Member From: Studio City, California, USA
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posted 23 December 2004 12:41 PM
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["Jerry's fingers are very compact, and after all these years, permanently formed to certain positions often used."] Is this true, literally? Please explain. |
Rick Aiello
Member From: Berryville, VA USA
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posted 23 December 2004 02:20 PM
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quote:
Is this true, literally? Please explain.
From the video close-ups I have seen of him playin' ... It sure appears as though his left index Distal Interphalangeal Joint (DIP) ...  ... allows his Distal Phalanx to make an almost 90 degree angle with the plane of his straightened index finger. I'm sure folks with "First Hand" knowledge ... will comment on this Right Angle - Phalang-elical anomaly  ------------------
Aiello's House of Gauss
My wife and I don't think alike. She donates money to the homeless and I donate money to the topless! ... R. Dangerfield
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David L. Donald
Member From: Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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posted 23 December 2004 02:24 PM
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Rick... was this done with a
Horse Shoe magenetic resonant imaging scan?HSMRI
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Rick Aiello
Member From: Berryville, VA USA
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posted 23 December 2004 02:38 PM
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Ron Whitfield
Member From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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posted 23 December 2004 04:17 PM
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Dan, as with any old timer who's done a lifetime of repetitive dexturous manouvers, their fingers go with the flow, especially if started from childhood.Jerry's hands are in fixed position, ready to play steel guitar at all times. He sez however, now that those day's are over, he's OK with it. Pretty cool attitude after decades of making musical history. |
oj hicks
Member From: Birmingham, Alabama, USA
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posted 24 December 2004 06:31 AM
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It appears, from watching Jerry's video, that the tip of the arched finger rests directly above the pivot point of the bar. For example, if he is slanting on a forward slant the tip of his finger generally rests over a point on the bar which would be over the second string in a 1st and 2nd string slant. (1st string being the highest pitch). He slips his thumb into the recess on the back of the bar to make reverse slants and pulls the back of the bar toward the right hand. Like some of you have mentioned, I have much longer fingers than JB. So I sat down with his recommended 3/4 x 2-3/4 bar and by analyzing the geometry of the situation and figured I needed a 3-5/16" long bar. I prefer the 7/8" diameter which is much easier for my fingers to hold. So, I had Jim Burden (Bullet Bars link on the "Links" page of this Forum) make me one. First class! I'm not a relative of Jim's, nor have I ever met him. I simply say he is a class act and makes a world-class product.  The bar has an inward cone surface in the back of the bar which is great for putting the thum in for reverse slants. Hope that helps. oj hicks |
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