The absolutely worst thing that happened during this "transaction" was that while I waited... and waited.. 2 months.... 4 months.. 6 months... while he claimed that the guitar was "in production" but delayed for various reasons - the real truth was that the guitar had been ready all the time but he had let a friend borrow it for several months, apparently to test it's "road worth", and get opinions from other US players.
This was so far out that I couldn't even get really mad at the time, some stuff is so weird that you don't know whether to laugh or cry.

It was a friend of mine who found this out, during a phone conversation with him, and when I confronted him with it he apologized and promised to get the guitar back and ship it asap. At the time I just thought that "Oh well, what the heck, I just want the (&%&%"/& guitar and be done with it without any more hazzles...."

Then, as you know, the guitar never arrived, he claim to have shipped it and I can't prove he hasn't, so there it stands...

I'll reply to his email and keep you posted, hopefully we will be able to sort this out without any more trouble.....

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

Well, I guess it's a used guitar then. He should discount accordingly.

quote:

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I can't prove he hasn't

---

If communications with the guy have broken down then you're doing the right thing by posting on the forum because that's about all you can do. We can talk BBB and mail fraud until the cows come home, but in their eyes it's a case of "he said she said".

But again, I'll write back to him very soon, and I hope we can sort it out and finish the whole thing. I hate stuff like this, I just want to live in peace, play my music, have a few beers and enjoy the Scandinavian blondes... I don't need stuff like this.....

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

quote:

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my personal integrity is extremely important to me

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I lost that when I was a teenager so I'd take the cash instead......anyhow. I'll drop him a line too.

[This message was edited by HowardR on 14 December 2005 at 02:02 PM.]

quote:

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He has a different side though I can tell you that.

---

I'm sure he has. I hope you get his permission to post it so I can see what he writes. I have offered to post his reply to me, to give him a chance to present his view, but haven't heard back yet.

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

[This message was edited by Steinar Gregertsen on 14 December 2005 at 02:04 PM.]

See you all tomorrow,- I'm overwhelmed by the responses I've received and I know a lot more about how to handle this now than I did last night. Thanks!

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

quote:

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enjoy the beer, the blondes and the music!

---

---------------------------------------------

My email:
Hi Eric,
You are getting some very effective publicity on Steel Guitar Forum. As you may know, this forum is populated by just about every Steel Guitar player in the world - membership over 5,000. Here's the link: http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum2/HTML/008263.html

They say any publicity is good publicity.

sincerely,
Rick Alexander http://rickalexander.com/BigSteel

------------------------------------

Eric Brown's response:

EbbTone09@aol.com wrote:

> Hi Rick,
> I have received some emails from this, both good and bad. I feel this is unjust without contacting first for more info. I consider Steinar a friend also. The article in question got a retraction from Joyce Grondin. Stating that only Two lapsteels were purchased buy Steinar and no other info could be confirmed. They said they got the info from Steinar's website. As far as $400.00 that was not the amount and I have all slips confirming that it was sent. I even sent all copies to him. I did not here from him and it has been almost two years. I built two the same as Steinar's design we worked out. The other went to Steinar's friend in California named David Seiglar, he got his fine.
> I am willing to follow up with this matter to confirm my statement.
> Eric Brown

---------------------------------------------

and my answer:

Hi Eric,
I don't want to be unfair to anyone. Steinar is my friend and I have no reason to doubt what he says - and that's the same thing all the other guys feel. There are several discrepencies between what he says and what you say. But if he sent you money for a guitar and then did not receive it that's your responsibility. The buyer has no way to monitor the shipment, the seller does. You didn't hear from him because he just figured he's been screwed and there wasn't anything he could do about it. He's a sensitive artist, not an aggressive consumer advocate. You and he need to resolve this quickly.
We are willing to post your side on the forum thread along with any further comments you have. We're ornery and mean - but in the final analysis, we're fair.

Rick Alexander http://rickalexander.com

Here we go:

quote:

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I feel this is unjust without contacting first for more info.

---

Fair enough. I realize that would have been the "proper procedure", and my only excuse is that I simply snapped when I read the article, it was, as you say - "the final straw that broke the camel's back".

quote:

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The article in question got a retraction from Joyce Grondin.

---

Well, if so then I find it strange that it still says the same. I have emptied the memory cache and cookies, but still I see no changes in the article, even after entering the site using three different browsers. If anybody can confirm that the stuff I quoted has been changed, please post and let me know.

quote:

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Stating that only Two lapsteels were purchased buy Steinar and no other info could be confirmed. They said they got the info from Steinar's website.

---

Well, this is completely beside the point, it doesn't matter if I ordered 2, 10 or 20 - I am not denying that I liked his guitar well enough to order one more and even recommend it to a good friend - my complaint is about what it says about the recording I am supposed to have used it on.

The way I see it, my name has been used to 'connect' his guitars to some "hot shots" - "Steel guitarist 'so-and-so' used it to record with these world famous artists" - and doing this he has falsely used my name to mislead the public.
That is a very serious matter to me.

quote:

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As far as $400.00 that was not the amount and I have all slips confirming that it was sent.

---

Now that's funny. On December 17th, 2003, I transferred $390 to Eric Brown - $350 for the guitar and $40 for shipping - and I have the PayPal receipt to prove it. So give or take $10.......

quote:

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I even sent all copies to him.

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Not correct. Unless he sent them by snailmail and the evil Postal Squirrel ate them....

quote:

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I did not here from him and it has been almost two years.

---

Again - not correct. Last winter/spring (I don't recall the exact date) I emailed Eric and asked what was going on, saying that I had more or less given up on it, and I got a reply where he claimed to have shipped it around Christmas time, 2004 (one year after I transfered the money). He also said that he would look into it, was eager to sort it out, and would get back to me later. So again I waited... and waited.. and then I gave up and he never heard from me again.

quote:

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I built two the same as Steinar's design we worked out.

---

Correct, and this is actually a quite interesting point. Here I helped him refine the design, based on the model I bought on eBay - we even thought about giving it a name that somehow refered to me - and I never get the instrument while I have seen others offered on eBay. Jolly good job, I dare say. Any wonder I snapped?

Now I desperately need some sleep - it's 3:30 in the morning over here - so I won't be 'available for comments' for a while.
I'll just add that I have requested copies of Eric's shipping document(s), and told him I am more than willing to find a reasonable way out of this that we both can live with. But I need concrete proof, no more yadda yadda.
I also want the paragraph mentioning me in that article removed or changed. One way or another.

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

I send this in case you have any doubts about the influence and
reach of the “Steel guitar Forum.” My experience is that reputable
traders would have long since offered a refund or replacement for
the sake of goodwill, regardless of right or wrong.

Patrick Kelly
Sydney, Australia

[This message was edited by Pat Kelly on 14 December 2005 at 06:35 PM.]

If Eric made the shipment (of which he states he has the shipping receipts) and was notified that it never arrived, why didn't he track it down or initiate an inquiry?

That's standard procedure, which brings us back to the question of "was it ever shipped".

Of course, on the positive side, he evidently thinks enough of your artistic abilities to use you as a reference (even if it's 100% wrong). In 10 or 15 years, people will throw on that CD and exclaim, "listen to that kick a** Norwegian! Did you know he also did the solo on 'Running on Empty' as well as the bottleneck part on 'Werewolves of London'?"

quote:

---

If Eric made the shipment (of which he states he has the shipping receipts) and was notified that it never arrived, why didn't he track it down or initiate an inquiry?

---

This is what he has to say about that:

quote:

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I sent copies to the USPS in Portland to find or confirm it's location. I still am not sure what more I could have done or what you would like for me to do. Sorry for any problems this caused.

---

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

HAPPY BIRTHDAY STEINAR !

[This message was edited by Rick Alexander on 15 December 2005 at 08:08 AM.]

quote:

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I sent copies to the USPS in Portland to find or confirm it's location. I still am not sure what more I could have done or what you would like for me to do. Sorry for any problems this caused.

---

Well, for one thing, wasn't it insured? If it didn't arrive an insurance claim should have been filed and Steinar would have gotten his money back...at the very least Steinar should not have been left holding an empty bag...some follow up should have happened. Which, like Howard said, brings us back to page one...was the guitar ever sent at all? Doesn't sound like it. So what can happen now...seems too late to file a complaint with the local Better Business Bureau or some other agency?

[This message was edited by Ron Bednar on 15 December 2005 at 08:06 AM.]

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'49 & '51 National Dynamics, Harmos Model One, Lazy River Weissenborn, Mesa Boogie DC-3, SRV Strat.
http://community.webshots.com/user/keefriff

So here's my theory: Since this was a friend of Eric's, he gave in and let him keep it, probably thinking that he could get another one ready pretty soon and ship that one to me. Now, for whatever reasons, this plan didn't work out - he could have been bogged down in other work, fammily issues, whatever - and somehow my guitar simply slipped away. Then, when I got back to him and asked for it (for the umpteenth time) he said it was shipped just to try and get off the hook.
Well, that's my theory anyway, and my gut feeling agrees......

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

quote:

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I sent copies to the USPS in Portland to find or confirm it's location

---

If the shipment was insured or registered, there would have been a form to fill out and submit with the tracking information. There would have to be some kind of resolve and documented communication between the USPS and the shipper.

If you just send it parcel post, there's no real way to track it. You still have to fill out a form for a lost package, but chances of them locating it are nil. It sounds like this is what happened from his statement "What more could I have done?"

So, he sent a receipt to the USPS, never heard back, and that's it? Game over?

quote:

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file a complaint with the local Better Business Bureau or some other agency?

---

Filing a complaint with the local BBB is all well and good, but I doubt if much of his business is local. This thread will ultimately have more impact than anything else would, because it is being read by thousands of Steel Guitar Players and other interested parties all over the world who are waiting to see how it plays out.

If Steinar doesn't get his money back or the new guitar he was promised - everyone will know. And no one will forget.

quote:

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Maybe a call from a big city manangement lawyer will help Steinar!!!

---

terry, thanks for your help. that was really nice.

I hope you're only joking about that guitar - I am happy with my three 6-strings (Asher, Lap King, mongrel "LapStrat" with Loni's "Redneck") and I'm really getting into the 8 strings of my new GeorgeBoards. So please don't even think of doing anything like that (well, if you have a vintage D8 Stringmaster... ) - it's not so much the guitar or the money, it's the principle.

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

quote:

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it's the principle.

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[This message was edited by Mark Vinbury on 15 December 2005 at 10:55 AM.]

and yes , I was joking.

quote:

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I consider Steinar a friend also.

---

That's all I have to say about that. Back to the business side of it.....

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com