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  Who really invented the "talking steel guitar"?

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This topic was originally posted in this forum: Wanted To Buy
Author Topic:   Who really invented the "talking steel guitar"?
Jim Cohen
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Posts: 8715
From: Philadelphia, PA
Registered: NOV 99

posted 09 March 2000 07:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Cohen     
Was it:

a) Alvino Rey

b) Pete Drake

c) Buddy Emmons

d) Pete Frampton

e) or some kid in shop class with an Erector Set?

What's the real story, fellas?

Buddy Emmons
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From: Hermitage, TN USA
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posted 09 March 2000 08:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Buddy Emmons     
Jim,
The original talking steel was a Sonavox Alvino Rey used. I don't know if Alvino had anything to do with it's creation, but he did make it popular through his recordings.

The talking tube was Neil Wilburn's idea. Neil was the first person to build an amp for the Sho~Bud company.

c c johnson
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From: killeen,tx usa
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posted 09 March 2000 09:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for c c johnson     
when I was a kid in Granite City Ill, us urchins would sneak into a aide room off stage at the Chase Hotel and see Alvino and his band,thatr is until the mater de found us. Before he went to the little box he would us the tone knob on the guitar to go from allbass to a degree of treblethat he wanted for the talking sound. He had a little six str gibson.He then had the gibson pedal guitar and then used the little box along with the tone control. By the way, I hold the record for being thrown out of the Chase as a 7 to 11 yr old.

------------------


Al Marcus
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From: Cedar Springs,MI USA
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posted 09 March 2000 07:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Marcus     
(a) Alvino Rey. Absolutely, both the talking tube and the bass to treble tone control. Good stuff, Buddy, make a record, like Pete Drake did,(he capitalized on it), and get another big hit.!!...al...How about making "
Sleepwalk" Talk????


Garryharris
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Posts: 156
From: Hendersonville, TN USA
Registered: MAR 2000

posted 09 March 2000 07:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Garryharris     
Pete Drake was up late one night watching TV when he saw a movie that gave him the idea for using this method on his guitar. He looked in to the method used in the movie and found out that Alvino Rey held the patent. He then used a hollow tube in his mouth, a varriation from the Alvino Rey method.


KENNY FORBESS
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From: peckerwood point, w. tn.
Registered: DEC 99

posted 10 March 2000 06:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for KENNY FORBESS     
Did Pete use that talk-box put out by Electro-Harmonic's? It's the Golden throat, works with a tube, hooks up in the speaker circuit.
I have one of these things, never used it.
anybody interested in it?
Is that what he used on ''Hello Wall's''?


Garryharris
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From: Hendersonville, TN USA
Registered: MAR 2000

posted 10 March 2000 06:54 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Garryharris     
Pet's first choice was going to be what aviators call a throat mike but this may have infringed on the Alvino Rey patent so he went to the hollow tube method.


Bobby Lee
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posted 10 March 2000 08:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bobby Lee     
I believe that the Electro-Harmonix box was derived from Pete Drake's approach. Pete did record "Sleepwalk" with it, by the way, as well as the hit "Forever".

As I understand it, Alvino Rey used a transducer strapped to the throat of a woman off-stage who was talking or singing the words.

Michael Johnstone
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From: Sylmar,Ca. USA
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posted 10 March 2000 10:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Michael Johnstone     
A few years ago,I saw an old early 70s "B" movie about somebody trying to make it as a country singer in Nashville,etc.I can't remember the name of the movie,but in it there is an extended scene of Pete Drake playing a Sho-Bud thru a talk box - live on film - the tune "I'm just a git-tar.....everybody picks on me" Kind of a blues tune.Anybody else remember that tune or that movie? -MJ-


Don Walters
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posted 10 March 2000 01:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Don Walters     
Michael, I have an LP by Pete Drake titled Forever that has "I'm just a Git-tar..", "Sleepwalk", "Still", and others on it. I have to be honest, I never really liked the "talking steel" part. In fact the album has never been one of my favourites

------------------
Don Walters
get "listed" at the World Wide Steel Guitarist Directory
www3.sk.sympatico.ca/waltd/
(aka On-Line Steel Guitarists of the World)



Sleepy John
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posted 10 March 2000 03:30 PM           
Michael
The Guy who Starred? in the Movie was Earl Richards, (real last name SINK and was married to Rita Fay, Child singer on the Ozark Jubilee after Brenda Lee.) who fronted for Del Reeves for a number of years, before George Owens.

Merle Travis and Minnie Pearl were also in the movie, if we are talking about the same one.

The guys in Petes Band were Harley Alsup on Bass, Bob Woods on Guitar and Corky Tittle on Drums. I picked with all of these guys in Key West Fla in the 60's.

------------------
Sj
"The Carolina Wildman"

[This message was edited by Sleepy John on 10 March 2000 at 03:43 PM.]



Bob Blair
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From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
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posted 10 March 2000 08:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bob Blair     
Wasn't that movie called "The Road to Nashville"? I seem to recall that Canada's own Bob Lucier made a cameo appearance in that in Bill Anderson's band.

Don't remember much about the movie, but I think the only good part was getting to see all the musicians etc.

Clarence E Wilson
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posted 11 March 2000 05:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Clarence E  Wilson     
Alvino demostrated the talking guitar at
St Louis one time. His wife said the words
from back stage.

Alvino's main instrument was the 'spanish'
guitar which he knew very well.

He told me one time, 'at his induction into
the hall of Fame', that he used the steel
guitar only when it's sound was called for.

I sat along side him in the audience.

CEW

Clarence E Wilson
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posted 11 March 2000 06:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Clarence E  Wilson     
I remember a movie starring Eddie Arnold
and the band, a cowboy movie in the old west.
Little Roy was riding along on a horse with
a six string electric lap steel laying across
his 'lap', doing his ting-a-ling thing.
Most of you were not even born when that
movie came out

not same subject, I know, but speaking of
fakes, as in 'talking steel guitars'

CEW

Terry Wood
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From: Marshfield, MO
Registered: MAR 2000

posted 11 March 2000 08:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Terry Wood     
Pete Drake did not invent the "Talking Steel Guitar," but he sure knew what to do with.

I realize that many steel players probably don't view his technical playing abilities or appreciate his steel guitar efforts as such, but Pete had a stroke of genius in his steel playing.

Lloyd Green informed me that he and Pete were big rivals in Nashville during the so-called "Golden Age," of Country music.
They were also friends and Pete loved not only the steel guitar but steel guitarists.

I remember being mesmerized by his pickin' prowess as a kid. I would set for hours at my cousins house and listen his "Hits I Played On" album. My cousins never knew beans about steel guitar but that record struck a chord in my heart. Another friend gave me an album of beautiful "Steel And Strings" with string arrangements and Pete's Talking Steel. I still enjoy that scratchy but classy album.

He played on so many hit records and helped to further the steel guitar as a legitimate instrument in other musical genre.
He also helped to sell records and friends that helps sell steel guitar.

We are all in this together. His talking steel is imprinted in the halls of my mind along with Julian, Buddy, Lloyd, Jimmy and others.

Terry Wood
Still a Pete Drake fan!




Al Marcus
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From: Cedar Springs,MI USA
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posted 11 March 2000 09:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Marcus     
I want to clarify this talking steel matter. I agree with some, that as a steel player, I did not really like it. HOWEVER as a steel player who wants to make a lot of money with the general public, Then let's bring it back with a hit record. It is a novelty and would sell...ok you top recording artists, get going and make some money and get that Pedal Steel Guitar out to the general public...al


Sleepy John
unregistered

Posts: 7471
From: Cedar Springs,MI USA
Registered: MAY 99

posted 11 March 2000 05:00 PM           
Pete manufactured the talk boxes during the 60's either in his own operation or thru somebody else. I'm not sure of who actually assembled them for him. Electro Harmonix didn't put their unit on the market until later.

I fixed some of his amps in the 70's and he had a filter and a switch in the output section on the speaker leads to filter out the low's so his teeth wouldn't be rattled.

Bill Stafford bought one of these units and probably still has it, but it didn't have any filtering or any instructions on how to filter out the lows.

------------------
Sj
"The Carolina Wildman"



Bobby Lee
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posted 12 March 2000 08:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bobby Lee     
I think to have a hit record with it today, it would have to be a rapping steel guitar.


Smiley Roberts
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From: Hendersonville,Tn. 37075
Registered: DEC 99

posted 14 March 2000 01:43 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Smiley Roberts     
I was told that Bill West,Dottie's ex- husband,came up with the idea.Reportedly,he tried to use a transistor radio (remember them??),earphone,but couldn't get enough audio power to it. I,still,have one that I built,myself,back in the mid '60's,& use on shows to this day. People are,still,fascinated by it,& there's a whole new generation out there that have never seen it. If you own one,use it on a show someday,& watch the audience reaction.

------------------

  ~ ~

mm
-=sr=-


road runner
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Posts: 4424
From: Hendersonville,Tn. 37075
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posted 14 March 2000 02:22 AM           
the name of the movie was tennesse beat.


Dave Van Allen
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posted 14 March 2000 08:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dave Van Allen     
or "That Tennesee Beat"??


or some dern thing...
had Statler Bros doing a lip synch to Flowers on the Wall as I recall, and of course
"I'm Just A Guitar"

caught it just once on the local TV afternoon movie 20 years ago... great cheezy flick with neat cameos

wayne yakes md
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From: denver, colorado
Registered: NOV 99

posted 14 March 2000 11:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for wayne yakes md     
Alvino Rey did a lot to popularize the "talking steel", but Buddy Gene Emmons experimented and took it to the next level (listen to "Burnt Fingers" on the "Western Strings" Ray Price album that Wade Ray sang in 1964). Pete Drake one fine day heard Emmons playing around with it, immediately recognized its importance, and proceeded to cut an album and popularize it. We cannot forget Emmon's major contribution into yet another aspect of the pedal steel guitar.


willie waits
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From: Hockley, Texas USA
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posted 14 March 2000 05:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for willie waits     
Dr. Yakes got it absolutely correct. I remember when E was experimenting with this and also have the albumn with "Burnt Fingers".


Vern Kendrick
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posted 18 March 2000 08:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Vern Kendrick     
What ever happened to Earl"Snake"Richards


pdl20
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From: Benton, Ar . USA,
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posted 23 March 2000 10:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for pdl20     
i used one on a show,did petes everybody picks on,got done pulled the tube out of my mouth and my partial bounced across the stage,i thought the bass player was going to lse it he laughed so hard,never used it again


Buddy Emmons
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From: Hermitage, TN USA
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posted 23 March 2000 11:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Buddy Emmons     
Now that the cat is out of the bag, here's "the rest of the story."
Shot and I were cutting an album at the Starday studio and I was trying to get the talking sound with tiny microphones I had turned into speakers and put in my mouth. The sounds from forming the words were louder than the talking effect so I was just about to give up when Neil Wilburn walked into the studio.

Neil was an electronics man who built the first Sho~Bud amp, so his car was always full of electronic paraphernalia. He went to his car and brought a box with a six inch speaker and a hole in the top at the speaker center. I hooked the terminals to my amp, stuck a plastic hose in the hole and voila, the sound came out the tube.

The song I was going to use the tube on was Danny Boy, but because the sound wasn't coming from in back of the tongue, and the sound was distorting, it wasn't as clear as I wanted it, so I trashed the idea temporarily. Meanwhile, Pete Drake had been sitting in the corner of the studio for the entire session. The next day, he went to Bill West and Bill mounted a speaker driver in a box, which eliminated the distortion.

Pete was on fire in the studios at the time and I couldn't buy a session. I finally got a call for an Anita Bryant session and took my improved box with me. I walked into the studio and one of the Jordanaires said, "Oh, I see you have one of those Pete Drake boxes." I smiled and said, "yeah." I used it on "Hey good Lookin" on the Anita Bryant session and Burnt Fingers on the Singin' Strings album, and that was the end of it for me.

The ironic part is that I got a message from Pete saying he wanted me to come to his office. I had heard he was thinking of marketing the talking tube so I thought, "Well, maybe ole Pete's conscience caught up with him and he was going to give me a piece of the action." I walked into his office and he pointed to his steel and said, "Could you show me the second chord to "Forever?" I showed him and walked out shaking my head.


Glenn Suchan
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From: Austin, Texas
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posted 23 March 2000 02:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Glenn Suchan     
Buddy,

On the Sonavox unit that Alvino Rey used: Years ago I was living in Batavia, IL. Not too far from my place was a music store called Hix Music (in North Aurora, IL, I believe). Anyway, the business was run by a father and son. The senor Mr. Hix claimed to have been the guy who "made Alvino's talk box".

Being young and impressionable, I didn't question the authenticity of Mr. Hix's bragging rights. I don't know if this jives with any knowledge that you may have on the Sonavox, but it's something that occured to me when you mentioned Alvino Rey.

BTW: If Neil Wilburn is who I'm thinking of, he also has done some great recording production work. Guy Clark's "Old Number One" album comes to mind. Am I correct in my thinking?

Thanks for giving so much to the world of steel guitar!

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn


Bill Stafford
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posted 23 March 2000 03:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Stafford     
And that lady behind the stage for Alvino was none other than the famous Louise King of the King Family. Thanks Alvino. .


Buddy Emmons
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From: Hermitage, TN USA
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posted 23 March 2000 04:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Buddy Emmons     
Glenn,
My only background on the Sonavox was what I found while researching it years ago at the Vanderbuilt library here in Nashville. They had an article about it in the 194? Time Magazine library files but I don't recall reading about the inventor.

I remember a Sonavox used on an old Bromo Seltzer radio commercial that had the words, "Bromo Seltzer, Bromo Seltzer, Bromo Seltzer in sync with a steam locomotive.

You're probably correct about Neil. I never saw him much after he left Sho~Bud but he became an studio engineer and producer later and I worked a few sessions with him. Cheers!



John Brabant
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From: Calais, VT, USA
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posted 23 March 2000 04:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for John Brabant     
Great to hear the talking box story from the horse's mouth. Neil Flanz had told me a few years back the story about Pete Drake appropriating Buddy's idea without acknowledgement. I may be mistaken, but I think Neil said Pete went so far as to patent the technology. Hey, just goes to prove, Buddy was always cooler than Drake, with or without his derby. Maybe Karma had some involvement here eh folks!


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