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Push-Pull question
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The Steel Guitar Forum
Pedal Steel Archive
Push-Pull question
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This topic was originally posted in this forum: Pedal Steel |
| Author | Topic: Push-Pull question |
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CT Member Posts: 8 |
posted 02 November 2001 09:16 AM
I play a early 70s Sho Bud Professional that is not a push pull and I've deducted from this forum that moving to a push pull would improve my tone. I'm interested to know what steels by name are "push pull". ie: are all Emmons Lashley LeGrands Push Pull? Are all Sho Bud Pro IIs push pull? Or is it not that simple? |
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Bobby Lee Sysop Posts: 14849 |
posted 02 November 2001 09:27 AM
Most often, "push-pull" is another way of saying "original Emmons". Almost all other pro model guitars are all-pull, including Sho-Bud. There are a handful of small builders who have made push-pull, and some student models (like the Sho-bud Maverick) are simplified push-pull designs, but the vast majority of push-pull guitars are pre-LeGrande Emmons. ------------------ |
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Glenn Austin Member Posts: 626 |
posted 02 November 2001 09:49 AM
Hey Charlie, I recently sold my Sho Bud Professional to get an Emmons push pull. One thing I can say about the Emmons is that the sound really cuts through all the clutter when I'm playing in a band situation. Otherwise I miss having that Sho Bud because it was a great sounding guitar too. If you want to make a huge improvement in tone for the Sho Bud, get yourself a set of Lawrence 710 pick ups. |
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Larry Bell Member Posts: 4116 |
posted 02 November 2001 10:18 AM
Every guitar has its own characteristic tone. The Emmons Original design is one of the few models that employed the 'push-pull' changer which, according to many in the 'know', transfer more of the string vibration to the body through the changer mechanism. Many of the early all-pull guitars seemed to lack the clarity, string separation, and brightness that the push-pulls have. If you like the push-pull characteristics, by all means get one -- they're not that expensive -- and most I've played have a decidedly unique tone. To answer your questions NO Sho-Buds or Emmons LeGrande models use the push-pull mechanism. Bobby Bowman is the only builder I'm aware of who still makes push-pull guitars -- and his is very different from the original Emmons design, with a changer at each end -- one for raises and one for lowers. My advice is to try one out before committing to a purchase. There are several 'Emmons-like' all pull guitars. The various models of the Emmons LeGrande, the ZumSteel, Fessenden, and Carter are brands that come to mind. NONE OF THEM HAVE ALL THE CHARACTERISTICS OF A PUSH-PULL, but each has its own individual tone. The only way to know what's right for you is to try them out. If you can do that without buying each one, you'll save a boatload of money. Just my opinion. I have two push-pulls, a D-10 and a S-12 universal and a Fessenden S-12. They're all three great guitars. Your old Sho-Bud is a great choice too. I'd hesitate before trading or selling it if you like the Bud sound. It's very much a part of the legacy of the pedal steel guitar. ------------------ |
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Jeff Lampert Member Posts: 2636 |
posted 02 November 2001 11:42 AM
quote: I would surmise from your post that you aren't happy with the sound of the Professional. You might consider doing a search on the Forum for topics that discuss the Professional. In doing so, you would find many players who love the tone of that guitar as well as Sho-Buds in general, and some players who would swear that it is as good a sounding guitar as they have ever heard. I say this not to discourage you from trying a push-pull, which is considered to be by a number of players the best-sounding guitar ever made, but only to consider the possibility that you haven't gotten everything in the way of sound that the Professional has to offer. Your amp and amp settings, technique, brand and newness of strings, as well as other points are all things that will have a large bearing on your sound. If you haven't already done so, then these things should be addressed in order that you get the best sound out of any guitar you play. |
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Jim Smith Member Posts: 6399 |
posted 02 November 2001 11:47 AM
Lloyd Green didn't sound too shabby on his Professional!  |
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Steve Stallings Member Posts: 2065 |
posted 02 November 2001 12:52 PM
"Tone is in the ear of the beholder" Tone is such a subjective thing. We have people who swear by the PP sound. We have those who think that the true path to tonal nirvana is the _______(fill in the blank) sound. Another camp is on a quest to obtain the best tone, only possible with the _____ Marketing...hype...truth...fiction. Yes, it's all there. We believe what we want to believe. Will you improve your sound by getting a push pull? Who knows? There are many folks who like the old Sho-bud sound. The only way you can find out is if you try it out. YOU have to decide if it is an improvement...or just different. A disclaimer: I am as guilty as anyone on this forum of the, this______ is the best sounding guitar, amp, effect, pedal, pick, string...etc, school of steel playing. Here is the real secret though...all of the pro guitars sound good, all of this stuff is good. The difference is in what we perceive. True, great tone, is an aquired art that has little to do with the brand of shorts the player is wearing. Paul Franklin would sound like Paul Franklin on anything. Buddy sounds like Buddy on anything. Recently, we had mass defections from Emmons to Zum. Guess what...these folks still sound just like themselves! Here's the kicker..and really sad part. I'm sure many of you can identify with it. No matter what I play, I still sound just like Steve Stallings....darn The best of luck in your quest. ------------------ [This message was edited by Steve Stallings on 02 November 2001 at 12:56 PM.] |
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patrick donovan Member Posts: 101 |
posted 02 November 2001 01:56 PM
Well, CWO Steve (Ret), you have discovered the true "secret" of steel playing! I always end up sounding exactly like "ME" no matter what I play on, BUT "Maybe" a different brand of beer would make the difference...hummmmm...what brand does Buddy favor? CWO Patrick (Ret) |
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Herb Steiner Member Posts: 6119 |
posted 02 November 2001 02:36 PM
quote: If the issue is "improving your tone," that can only be done by learning to use your hands and body in the correct way to produce music on the instrument. Sadly But tone is only one criteria of why we want to change guitars. If you really feel that you've gotten all you can possibly get out of your ShoBud, or that playing an Emmons is the way you see yourself in your mind's eye... your own self-image, as it were, go for the change. ------------------ |
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Al Marcus Member Posts: 7471 |
posted 02 November 2001 08:05 PM
I must say that I agree with a lot of what is said on this subject. The Sho-Bud Professional had a distinct sound of its own as well as the Emmons Push Pull, both different but Players like Lloyd Green , Hal Rugg, and many others got a great sound out of those Sho-Buds. If I had to choose between the two guitars, I would have to take the Sho-bud because of it's all pull design, no half stops that have to be adjusted from underneath, and with the Professional Rack and Barrel tuning, virtually unlimited Raises and lowers for more complicated modern tunings.,......al |
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George Duncan Sypert Member Posts: 212 |
posted 03 November 2001 08:51 AM
The best sounding guitar, amp,effects,or whatever is always being played by someone else.  |
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Joe Henry Member Posts: 909 |
posted 04 November 2001 11:33 AM
OOPS- I got the first part wrong. I thought you were talking about changing the mechanics to push-pull. By all means, donīt do that. I, personally, would be happy if I had a Professional. If youīre looking for that push-pull tone, sell the ShoBud and get an Emmons and you canīt lose. I agree they are vastly different. Just one example, the Commander Cody records from the early ī70s with Bobby Black playing his Professional and then "Tales From The Ozone" from 1975 where he had moved to Emmons. Now Bobby is a great player who certainly sounds like himself no matter what he plays. But the difference in the tone is there. [This message was edited by Joe Henry on 04 November 2001 at 11:42 AM.] |
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