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Author
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Topic: organ effect
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Cody Campbell
Member From: Kentucky, USA
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posted 21 May 2005 02:07 PM
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I'm curious about this sound. Does anyone know of an effect that would make a steel sound like an organ?
(Note to b0b: I'm posting this in "steel players" because I first heard the sound on a Lloyd Green record). Also, I don't know if the sound is even being caused by pre-amp effect boxes/modules. It may, in fact be the result of simply amplifying the steel guitar through a rotating speaker, (like a Leslie, in which the horn spins around above the bigger speaker below). So I honestly don't know whether this belongs in "electronics" or "pedal steel" or what. (Plus, I prefer posting here in "steel players" where EVERYONE on the planet can read it).
But as far as a reference for you all to go by, I think the sound can be heard in the song "wurlitzer prize" by Waylon Jennings, in all of the steel fill. I just heard that song on the radio and it re-sparked my curiosity.
But I originally heard the sound on Lloyd Green's instrumental version of "There goes my everything." It occurs only on the turnaround, right in the middle, immediately after the first chorus. When I first heard it I swore "That's GOT to be an organ" but after I burned the album from vinyl to disc and ran the part back a couple times I realized the notes were bending and it couldn't possibly be organ.
(For those who've heard it, the turnaround goes like I,V,I,V and both times on the "one" chord, a voice is being 'bent' from a 3rd to a really quick 2nd, and right back up). I guess it would be convenient if I'd just post a sound clip as an example for these little parts that I ask about, but I seem to have a learning disability when it comes to computers. Sorry.
I don't know if the thing from LG is the same as what's on the Waylon tune, it just sounded similar.
If I'm right about the LG turnaround being steel, then it seems that the part would HAVE to have been overdubbed, cause it comes RIGHT off the chorus with no space at all for a musical breath.
Any reply will be appreciated. (Even if you don't know what makes the "sound" just let me know if you're familiar with the recording).Thanks! -cody |
Eric West
Member From: Portland, Oregon, USA
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posted 21 May 2005 02:20 PM
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Mr Emmons used a simple MXR Phase 90 when doing his Redneck Jazz performances. Sounded pretty "organesque" to me. The Phase shifter on the Session 500s gave/give a similar effect. Buddy Charleton about the same time used to use one regularly. His explainantion was that a lot of times it separated it from the guitar or other instruments. I or somebody that talk to Mr Green regularly will undoubtably ask him. I probably won't for another month, since I just did not long ago, and it wasn't one of the things I asked about. 
EJL |
John Daugherty
Member From: Rolla, Missouri, USA
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posted 21 May 2005 03:22 PM
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That's right, the phase-shift effect,with enough strength, does give an organ effect. A mix of phase-shift and tremolo can be made to sound like a "Leslie" speaker.
Some effects units have an effect called "roto" that simulates a rotating (Leslie)speaker. |
Jack Stoner
Sysop From: Inverness, Florida
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posted 21 May 2005 03:32 PM
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I had a DOD 565 Stereo Chorus "stomp box" that made a good Leslie emulator. I bought it for chorus but it would distort on more than one string, but sped up it gave a good leslie sound and the small amount of distortion wasn't notice. I used that about 15 years.My POD XT has several Leslie models in it, including a rotating horn. |
Jody Sanders
Member From: Magnolia,Texas
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posted 21 May 2005 11:12 PM
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Remember the little units called 'Junior'. Had a good organ sound. The profex 2 has a good organ setting. In the late 60's, Fender had a large amp type unit that got a good organ sound. Jody.[This message was edited by Jody Sanders on 21 May 2005 at 11:15 PM.] |
Kevin Mincke
Member From: Farmington, MN (Twin Cities-South Metro) USA
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posted 21 May 2005 11:13 PM
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I used to use an Electro Harmonix "Electric Mistress" |
Michael Johnstone
Member From: Sylmar,Ca. USA
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posted 22 May 2005 12:22 AM
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A lot of guys feel like the Hughes & Kettner Tube Rotosphere is the best Leslie effect pedal around at the moment. I got one and it's close enough for me - especially thru a tube amp. -MJ- |
Smiley Roberts
Member From: Hendersonville,Tn. 37075
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posted 22 May 2005 02:45 AM
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Back in,about,'66,or '67,I heard Jimmy Day use a Cordovox Leslie tone cabinet on a recording. I,seriously,thought it was an organ. I had to have one. I,eventually,got one. It was a GREAT effect,HOWEVER,the cabinet was bigger than my amp,& only housed an 8" speaker, The rest of the space was taken up by a rotating wooden "paddle wheel". Excellent,in a studio situation,but lousy on a "live" situation. I "blew" several speakers,tryin' to kick it too hard. Too much to carry around,for 1 or 2 songs. Finally got rid of it. Then,Electro-Harmonix came out w/ an "Electric Mistress" stomp box. It had a GREAT Leslie effect in it. Unfortunately,I can't find an 18 volt d.c. xformer for it,so I had to quit using it. Now,I get the same effect out of my P.V. "ProFex II",(program # 41). If ya got one,check it out.
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~ ~
©¿© It don't mean a thang,
mm if it ain't got that twang.
www.ntsga.com |
Dan Tyack
Member From: Seattle, WA USA
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posted 22 May 2005 02:53 AM
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If you want to sound like an organ, it's hard to beat the Hughes & Kettner Tube Rotosphere. It nails that sound. The only thing I like better is the Motion Sound leslie speaker. THis this sounds amazing, especially since it is extremely adjustable (unlike the H&K). I love the REALLY slow sound. |
Cody Campbell
Member From: Kentucky, USA
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posted 22 May 2005 02:56 AM
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Thanks for the replies, everyone.
I guess this post DID belong in the "electronics" page, after all.
(tell me what Mr. Green used).
Thank you all!
-cody |
Craig A Davidson
Member From: Wisconsin Rapids, Wisconsin USA
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posted 22 May 2005 06:41 AM
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My Delta-Fex also has a Leslie setting. |
Jon Light
Member From: Brooklyn, NY
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posted 22 May 2005 06:53 AM
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The H&K Rotosphere in combination with a two button handswitch that I built that I attach right by the changer does it for me. It's fun to swipe at the ramp-up, ramp-down button for effect. |
Marty Pollard
Member From: a confidential source
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posted 22 May 2005 06:55 AM
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Don Williams' "I Believe In Love" has Lloyd using just volume pedal swells throughout that simulates organ very well. |
Jim Smith
Member From: Plano, TX, USA
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posted 22 May 2005 07:30 AM
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Red Rhodes used to get a very believable Leslie effect with just a very heavy vibrato on his bar hand. |
Jerry Gleason
Member From: Eugene, Oregon
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posted 22 May 2005 02:16 PM
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I had a Peavey Max 100 processor that had a decent Leslie effect, including a realistic spin up/down. It was a fairly inexpensive stomp box preamp / effects processor, probably no longer made. I used it for a jazz organ effect with pedal steel on this home recording from several years ago: Low Life (4.5 MB Mp3) This is one of those one-man band recordings where I played all the parts, so I apologize in advance for any bad playing. |
Ricky Littleton
Member From: Steely-Eyed Missile Man from Orlando, Florida USA
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posted 22 May 2005 08:40 PM
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My PX-4 Pandora's box has an organ setting. Pretty funky, but fun to play around with.Ricky ------------------
Emmons LeGrande - 8x4
Session 400 Ltd, Nashville 112,Hilton Volume pedal, Peterson VS-II Tuner
Dan-Echo, E-Bow, Ibanez Distortion, Boss Comp./Sustain, Ibanez Auto-Wah, PX4 Pandoras Box |
Ron Steenwijk
Member From: Greensburg,PA
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posted 23 May 2005 12:25 AM
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Cody,Tommy Detamore used this on one of the last "Doug Sahm" albums.I think Tommy can fill you in how this was done.He mailed me some time ago and mentioned how he did it but I seem to have forgotten about it.Tommy is a regular visitor on this forum.So if you post a topic for Tommy Í'm sure he will answer.[This message was edited by Ronald Steenwijk on 23 May 2005 at 04:11 AM.] |
Gene Jones
Member From: Oklahoma City, OK USA
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posted 23 May 2005 05:06 AM
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Thanks Jerry Gleason for posting your recording of "Low Life". The lift I got from that will last all day on this rainy Monday! www.genejones.com |
Howard Tate
Member From: Leesville, Louisiana, USA
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posted 23 May 2005 06:16 AM
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I agree with Gene, very tasty pickin'. Love the sound.------------------
Howard, 'Les Paul Recording, Zum S12U, Vegas 400, Boss ME-5, Boss DM-3
http://www.Charmedmusic.com
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Tony Palmer
Member From: Lincoln, RI USA
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posted 23 May 2005 08:05 AM
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It's true that with the right strings and a heavy vibrato you can get a quick organ-like sound in a pinch.
Try strings 4,5 and 8 with a super vibrato and strong picking attack...it works for a quick fix. |
Johan Jansen
Member From: Europe
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posted 23 May 2005 08:10 AM
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Chorus, Pitch Shifter, Harmoniser,overdrive and a lot of tweekin' ------------------
 Click on the pic!
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Dave Burr
Member From: Tyler, TX
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posted 23 May 2005 08:16 AM
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Smiley said:
quote:
Back in,about,'66,or '67,I heard Jimmy Day use a Cordovox Leslie tone cabinet on a recording. I,seriously,thought it was an organ.
Smiley, Is that what Jimmy used on "Farewell Party" with Johnny Bush? I've always wondered what technique Jimmy was using to get the "organ effect".
Respectfully,
Dave Burr
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CrowBear Schmitt
Member From: Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France
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posted 23 May 2005 09:31 AM
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Jerry G's always got some good sounds
how' bout some more bro ? :!
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Gene Jones
Member From: Oklahoma City, OK USA
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posted 23 May 2005 10:11 AM
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The Cord-O-Vox Leslie in it's time was as authentic an organ sound as you could get. I hauled one around along with a Standel Amp and an Echo-Plex for for about eight years....an amazing accomplishment for a middle aged steel player. www.genejones.com [This message was edited by Gene Jones on 23 May 2005 at 10:14 AM.] |
William Steward
Member From: Grand Cayman, Cayman Islands
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posted 23 May 2005 09:01 PM
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Check out the Motion Sound leslie 'simulators'(eg: Pro-3T model). They use a real rotating treble horn and send the bass signal (that would normally be produced by a bass horn rotating in the opposite direction)as a signal to an amp. The simulator is a 'little' bigger than an effect box but beats any of the simulators I have tried (only 3). http://www.motion-sound.com/rotary_amps.htm |
Richard Sinkler
Member From: Fremont, California
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posted 24 May 2005 03:25 AM
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I used to use a Junior back in the 70's. It was a great unit. Now I just use a Korg CX-3 drawbar organ.------------------
Carter D10 9p/10k, NV400
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David Spangler
Member From: Kerrville, TX USA
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posted 24 May 2005 06:21 AM
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The POD XT has a very convincing Leslie effect. I use it often with great results.------------------
David Spangler |
Mike Brown
Member From: Meridian, Mississippi USA
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posted 24 May 2005 08:12 AM
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The new Peavey Duel Deltafex has a rotating speaker effect which can be gradually ramped up or slowed down with the push of a single button footswitch. This product will be available soon. Mike Brown
Peavey Electronics Corporation |
Richard Sinkler
Member From: Fremont, California
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posted 26 May 2005 03:04 AM
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Hey Mike. That's good to hear. Is this unit going to be stereo? In my opinion, the greatest thing about a leslie is the sound of the rotor/horn ramping up and slowing down, which I haven't seen done convincingly in electronic units in the past. In the synthesizer world, the rotary speaker sound has become very convincing and very adjustable in the speed control as well as imitating microphone distance and separation in relation to a real leslie speaker. This is the type of thing that I would like to see in a portable unit for steel. Of course, this may be a little over the top, price wise, for a few songs a night.------------------
Carter D10 9p/10k, NV400
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Mike Brown
Member From: Meridian, Mississippi USA
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posted 26 May 2005 06:41 AM
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Yes, it is stereo. The good thing is that the U.S. MSRP is $219.99! It will be on the market soon. |
Grant Johnson
Member From: Nashville TN
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posted 26 May 2005 08:40 AM
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The Rolls RFX "Twin Spin" is very good for the $$$.
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/src=SearchDex/search/detail/base_pid/150903 Not quite as good as the H&K, but pretty good to my ears. |
Donny Hinson
Member From: Balto., Md. U.S.A.
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posted 26 May 2005 08:45 AM
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I have an old MXR "Phase 90", as well as a "Phase 100". I believe the "100" is the one Buddy used. The "Phase 90" only does a slow phase-shift, and doesn't have the "fast" Leslie-effect. |
Robbie Daniels
Member From: Casper, Wyoming, USA
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posted 26 May 2005 09:37 AM
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I have a Leslie 116 which gives the authentic fast and slow leslie, but the weight factor lugging it around makes it sit in my studio. You can also get the Leslie sound on Genisis III and various slows and fast Leslies on Peavey Transfex Pro and of course the lightest and most convenient is the Genisis III. Strange enough some twenty or so years ago I was getting a fairly close organ effect out of a flanger stomp box that I had.------------------
MSA D12, MSA S12, 1956 Rickenbacker D8, Evans FET 500LV, Evans SE200, Peavey Transfex Pro |
ajm
Member From: Los Angeles
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posted 28 May 2005 08:56 AM
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Smiley:
"Then,Electro-Harmonix came out w/ an "Electric Mistress" stomp box. It had a GREAT Leslie effect in it. Unfortunately,I can't find an 18 volt d.c. xformer for it,so I had to quit using it. "I have an old one from the 70's also. It will run off of a 9v adapter, but you may have to tweak the trimpots inside. The 18vdc adapters are around; try some electronics swap meets, or watch in music stores for the boxes of $1 stuff. Also, try Sam Ash or some of the other online places. And to get back to the original post...... Do you want your steel to sound like:
a) a steel guitar through a Leslie, or
b) an organ through a Leslie? There is a difference.
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Artie McEwan
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Keith Cordell
Member From: Atlanta
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posted 28 May 2005 11:10 AM
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18VDC Adaptors can be had at Radio Shack for about $18. ------------------
Rickenbacher T-Logo Bakelite lap steel, Peavey Delta Blues, Proco Rat, Lap Dawg bar |
Richard Sinkler
Member From: Fremont, California
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posted 02 June 2005 03:27 AM
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quote:
Do you want your steel to sound like:
a) a steel guitar through a Leslie, or
b) an organ through a Leslie?
This is the million dollar question. I always wanted to sound more like an organ for those songs where a steel guitar really wasn't appropriate or just to get a variety of instrument sounds instead of just the sound of the steel guitar for 4 hours a night. At one point in my career, I was so tired of not only playing the steel guitar for 4 hours a night, but listening to it for 4 hours a night. I almost gave up playing because of this. That is when I started to learn how to play keyboards to break the boredom. So, the way you answer this question will tell you which direction you should go. No matter what effect you use, or even plugging into a Leslie, will not make you sound like a B-3. ------------------
Carter D10 9p/10k, NV400
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Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 02 June 2005 07:39 AM
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I play gospel songs, exclusively. I have an H & K Rotosphere hooked up whenever I play. I use a two button remote with my H & K. This allows me remote access to the unit. I usually play one round with straight steel and then kick in the Leslie effect for a chorus or so. Like Richard said, it helps break it up a little bit. 
Erv |
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