Author
|
Topic: Nashville 112 Mod
|
Wayne Cox Member From: Chatham, Louisiana, USA
|
posted 01 April 2006 08:14 PM
profile
Have any electronic changes or modifications been made in the N112 (by Peavey) since it was first released about 2.5 years ago? ~~W.C.~~ |
Jack Stoner Sysop From: Inverness, Florida
|
posted 02 April 2006 04:22 AM
profile
No, and there doesn't appear to be any changes needed, either. Sorry to rant, but why does all equipment need modifications? Except for the Nashville 400 "mod" that actually changed the EQ circuitry that's the only "mod". There have been other Peavey options that change the Op-Amps to a lower noise version but as a former amp tech I don't see these as "mods". |
Donny Hinson Member From: Balto., Md. U.S.A.
|
posted 02 April 2006 05:27 AM
profile
Jack, for many years, players complained that Peavey amps sound "nasal". This was caused by Peavey purposely lowering the bass response to help eliminate speaker warranty problems. John LeMay came out with a mod kit which included better (quieter) op-amps, but more importantly, the tone network capacitors in the kit restored the full range of frequency response, and got rid of that "nasily" character and gave the amp some real warmth. Peavey, seeing the popularity of John's "mod kit", eventually came out with their own similar version, which they soon incorporated into all their steel amps. |
Jack Stoner Sysop From: Inverness, Florida
|
posted 02 April 2006 06:55 AM
profile
Donny, the Nashville 400 tone mod was required because the original Nashville 400's were "voiced" for the 1502 BW speaker. When they went to 1501 BW speaker, with a different frequency response, they did not change the amp and thus the problems. The change in the "voicing" that John Lemay did made the Nashville 400 with the 1501 speaker's response more or less equivalent to the original models with the 1502 speaker. I've played through an original model Nashville 400 (with the 1502 speaker), the later models with the 1501 speaker and no "mod" and I owned a later 400 that had the factory tone mod installed. The original Nashville 400 and the later ones with the tone mod are about equal. The later model without the tone mod is all highs and no lows or "body". I spent about two hours at Scotty's trying out a demo Nashville 400 with a 1501 speaker (it had been used as a stage amp at the ISGC) and no tone mod and nothing I could do to the amp would tame the highs or get enough lows. Peavey lists the 1502 speaker as a "bass" speaker. |
Brad Sarno Member From: St. Louis, MO USA
|
posted 02 April 2006 08:57 AM
profile
Out of habit, I re-capped my NV112. I didn't mess with the design or parts values at all. I kept the original values. If you look inside a NV112, you'll see a whole bunch of these little tiny shiny yellow cap's. Those are ceramic monolithic type capacitors. They are the standard these days for the AI (auto insertion) methods where robots insert the components into a circuit board. They are far and away the least expensive and smallest choice of cap, and large companies invariable choose them for those reasons. They are widely understood to be less than the most favorable sounding capacitors. You see them a lot these days in modern electronics. So I carefully pulled all of them and replaced them with hi-grade polypropylene film types. The improvement was pretty obvious. It's not that the stock amp sounds bad by any means, but it sure is a bit limited by the use of those types of caps. The voicing of the amp doesn't change with the upgrade, but the overall tone quality is enhanced and takes on a more silky and punchy sound. It's kind of like wiping a haze off a window. However, I would NOT recommend this cap upgrade as I would for the older Peaveys. These new amps like the NV1000 and NV112 (they use the same preamp board) have extremely small and delicate circuit board traces that are easily damaged by removing and replacing components. I'd say leave the amp alone. It sounds good enough out of the box. Brad |
Donny Hinson Member From: Balto., Md. U.S.A.
|
posted 02 April 2006 10:56 AM
profile
Jack, here's a quote in Mike Brown's own words... quote: ...I can tell you that we rolled off the low end frequencies purposely so that speaker failure would be less likely.
Plainly, it had nothing to do with "speaker voicing", and everything to do with cutting the lows (and a lot of the sound quality) to prevent speaker (warrantry) problems. Peavey amps were known for years to be "honky" and "nasal". If it were just the speaker involved, everyone would have just changed the speaker!  I certainly applaud Peavey for all that they have done for steelers, they're a fine vendor (compared to smug Fender, who ignored us for decades). Nonetheless, I must also applaud John LeMay, he's the person who gave Peavey the impetus to stop building "honky" amps.  |
Wayne Cox Member From: Chatham, Louisiana, USA
|
posted 02 April 2006 11:25 AM
profile
Thanks guys, for clearing that up for me. This forum contains a wealth of knowledge. We sure owe b0b for creating it. ~~W.C.~~ |
Jack Stoner Sysop From: Inverness, Florida
|
posted 02 April 2006 12:13 PM
profile
Donny, Peavey did do that in their version of the "mod" on the Nashville 400. In the Lemay mod there is one additonal cap (I think it's C41) and with the value that Lemay uses there is quite a bit more lows than the stock Peavey cap. Actually, it's too much as I tried it in my 400 and the bass got boomy.With the Lemay mod components there is a much greater potential of speaker damage due to low frequencies - and not that it will happen just that the potential is there. Peavey may not want to publicly acknowledge they dropped the ball when they went to the 1501 speaker and didn't change the amp's EQ. I've installed the "mod" in an older model Nashville 400 (with the 1502 speaker) and I couldn't tell any difference. I've installed the mod in several newer Nashville 400's and there is a definate difference. |
Brad Sarno Member From: St. Louis, MO USA
|
posted 02 April 2006 12:35 PM
profile
There may be some logic to restricting the bass response on the NV400. When you have a 15" in a small cabinet designed for a 12" like the NV400, it can be easy to send too much bass to a speaker because you just won't hear the low end. That speaker can be floppin around with lows, but due to the acoustics of the cabinet size, they go un-noticed, thus the tendency to hurt a speaker. Just a thought. Brad
|
Brad Sarno Member From: St. Louis, MO USA
|
posted 02 April 2006 12:36 PM
profile
Hey Jack, what was the 1502? Was that the ribbed bass speaker cone? Brad [This message was edited by Brad Sarno on 02 April 2006 at 12:37 PM.]
|
Greg Cutshaw Member From: Corry, PA, USA
|
posted 02 April 2006 01:16 PM
profile
I agree with you Donny. Peavey has been great to steel players but many of their steel amps have had that "honky, nasal" sound, some of it from cutting the midrange in a solid state amp and some from the extreme lack of bass. Certainly noticeable on the C9th tuning and somewhat on the E9th tuning. To my ears the 1501 and 1502 speakers sounded very similar in the Session 400, I've had both. Thanks to Lemay for waking us up! Both the Lemay and the Peavey factory mod make HUGE differences in the EQ, nothing subtle there and very noticeable with either the 1501 or 1502. On the other hand, my Peavey Nashville 112 has started to sound warmer every day and the EQ allows for pretty decent bass. Not as full range or warm as some of my tube amps, buy very smooth and not too boomy. Whether or not a "mod" is needed is a matter of personal preference. Developing and trying out mods is a lot of fun and few people will deny that some aspect of their amp can be improved. For example I would like to see a Nashville 112 reverb mod that will give that lush Fender reverb sound similar to the Nashville 400 reverb mod. Then I could eliminate my RV-5 and run direct from my pedal to the amp. Greg |
Ken Fox Member From: Ray City, GA USA
|
posted 02 April 2006 05:46 PM
profile
Brad, I had a Session 400 with a 1502 in recently, it was a ribbed cone. I have a 1983 Nashville 400 in the shop with a 1502 in it as well, also a ribbed cone. It will be re-tolexed in about a week, new hardware and a new grill. Great sounding amp against Nashville 400 amps I have played with a stock 1501-4SB. I compared it with a 1985 I had in the shop last week as well. It had a Peavey mod in it and a 1501-SB. Amps sounded very similar to me. |
Jack Stoner Sysop From: Inverness, Florida
|
posted 03 April 2006 03:51 AM
profile
The 1502 is the speaker that was used in the old Session 500. The ones in the early Nashville 400's, that I saw were the same. I've played Peavey's with the Mid Parametric EQ since 1981 (with a Session 500 and later with a Nashville 400 with factory mod, a 1000 and now a 112) and I always hear about the Peavey "honk" but I never experienced it. I think it's how you adjust the amp. I get a lot of complements on my sound and/or how good my amp sounds. |
David Wren Member From: Placerville, California, USA
|
posted 03 April 2006 04:16 PM
profile
Jack, I have two of the old session 500s, and re: the parmetric equalizer... for years I used boosting bass to get a full bottom end, but after reading that it's boosting bass that takes the headroom, I tried cutting some mids... leaving the bass at 0.... what do you recommend? Haven't messed with this comcept enough to convince myself I like it better than boosting the bass.------------------ Dave Wren '95Carter S12-E9/B6,7X7; Twin Session 500s; Hilton Pedal; Black Box www.ameechapman.com
[This message was edited by David Wren on 03 April 2006 at 04:18 PM.]
|
Jack Stoner Sysop From: Inverness, Florida
|
posted 03 April 2006 04:59 PM
profile
Dave, from what I remember I set the low at 3 O'clock (+9?), the mid at 800Hz and the cut at about - 2.5. Highs and Presence were at 0 or just slightly on the plus side. The Session 500 I had was one of the original "small cabinet" models but I don't thing the EQ settings are different in the later larger cabinet models (the electronics and speaker are the same).This was with both a 71 Emmons D-10 with stock pickups and later with a Franklin D-10 with Lawrence 705 pickups. Also, I always sat the amp up on a chair. If you have it sitting on the floor or just slightly off the floor the settings will change. |
David Wren Member From: Placerville, California, USA
|
posted 05 April 2006 11:43 AM
profile
Thanks Jack, very close to my age old settings, and I also use a crate to get it off the floor.... good info, why fix it if it ain't broke.
------------------ Dave Wren '95Carter S12-E9/B6,7X7; Twin Session 500s; Hilton Pedal; Black Box www.ameechapman.com
|
Mike Brown Member From: Meridian, Mississippi USA
|
posted 05 April 2006 12:10 PM
profile
Yes, Peavey introduced mod kits during the late '90's for the Nashville 400, Session 400 Limited, Vegas 400, Session 500 and Profex II products in our MI line. Our intention was to offer "affordable" mod kits for the original Peavey designed amplifiers. The following is a quote from Hartley Peavey from our website, “At the beginning of 1964, I decided I would do what every musician I talked to said . . . "I wish someone would build good guitars, amps and P.A. systems at a fair and reasonable price." That sounded good to me.Leo Fender has always been my idol. When he started his company in 1946, he started out building damn good products that weren't fancy but represented great performance and great value. I figured if it was good enough for Leo, it was good enough for me. I decided then and there that I would build the best musical equipment possible at fair and reasonable prices, even though I knew it would have to be done a different, and hopefully better, way". This is still the Peavey motto even today. When a third party(who didn't assist in the design of the original Nashville 400 amplifier) decides that they want to "hot rod" or replace parts on an existing circuit, that is not a large task and can be accomplished easily. As a matter of fact, I wonder if the Hot Rod Deluxe amp was simply an old circuit design with new parts.................hmmmmmmmmmmmm. The objective was to offer our kits at reasonable prices to our customers who had purchased our products. That's what we did. Also, what we "purposely" included in our kit was a higher rolloff point so that speakers were protected from too much low end frequency when using an open back cabinet design. After all, Peavey Electronics was the company that warranteed the speaker, not the third party company. Also in our mod kit, we used what is considered as a highly respected integrated circuit called the Burr Brown OPA 2604. Occasionally, we receive a Peavey model with another mod kit installed, and all of the IC's are masked with fingernail polish. Are these the same factory IC's to begin with? Hmmmmmm............................ Just thinking aloud. |