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Author
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Topic: Santo & Johnny live 1959 YOUTUBE
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Bernard Beck
Member From: Paris France
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posted 21 September 2006 09:37 AM
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My steelguitar teacher loved the video but he suggested that it might be a playback with the original record behind.
But that does not mean this document is not a precious treasure anyway.
What do you think of the idea
Bernard |
Derrick Mau
Member From: Honolulu, Hawaii, USA
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posted 21 September 2006 10:18 AM
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In the original vinyl recording, they are playing in the key of C#.In this live performance, key of C, so they are not using the original recording as a playback. However, it's looks like the TV studio had pre-recorded the song, then they had to lip sync, or steel sync the performance on stage. Watch the strumming carefully on the guitar player. Doesn't seem to be in sync. |
Earnest Bovine
Member From: Los Angeles CA USA
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posted 21 September 2006 11:24 AM
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I think it is synchronized as well as anything can be on youtube. It looks like he is really playing it in C. |
Mark Vinbury
Member From: N. Kingstown, Rhode Island, USA
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posted 21 September 2006 11:25 AM
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This is clearly a sound overdub.
You can't hear most of the guitar strumming.
Granted they might have cut the guitar out but also a close look will show subtle differences in the steel sound and what is actually being played. Edit:: I was convinced the sound was overdubbed on this now after a few more listens I'm not so sure.
One thing I noticed ---there is a "hiccup" in the track when the camera shows a closeup of the guitar during what I call the bridge. I have a feeling these guys were not opposed to messing with the recording.
I've always suspected that the opening "signature" notes on the original Sleepwalk were played on a different guitar than the rest of the tune.
My understanding is artists back then were very quiet about their techniques. [This message was edited by Mark Vinbury on 22 September 2006 at 09:38 AM.] |
Jesse Pearson
Member From: San Diego , CA
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posted 21 September 2006 11:29 AM
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It's hard to tell how accurate the old time visual/audio systems were in general for live sync ups?I like what the bass player was doing, so I tabbed it out to compare to the chords on the studio version. Did anybody else notice that the bass is staying on the C note for the 6th measure? It should be A minor there? It doesn't sound bad because you can't really hear the guitar strumming in 6/8 on this recording until well into the song. I don't know if they reharmonized the intro or the bass player made a mistake live? If it was a studio made to sound live sync up, what is this saying about the 6th measure on the intro? If it was the studio, I think they would have fixed it, don't you? Personally, I think the bass player goofed on a live T.V. performance, but no biggy because the C note is the minor 3rd of A minor. Also, the guitar would have be more up front on a studio mix?
The original studio recording was probable sped up a half step for the mix down? I know a few songs that were hits that got sped up in pitch for the mix down.
[This message was edited by Jesse Pearson on 21 September 2006 at 11:47 AM.]
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Herb Steiner
Member From: Cedar Valley, Travis County TX
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posted 21 September 2006 11:43 AM
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Re the dichotomy between C and C# on the original version, I asked Johnny Farina about the recording being in C#, and he was clueless, saying they "recorded it in C on the C#minor tuning."The original tape might have been speeded up when it was mastered. quote:
Did anyone else notice that their bodies looked out of proportion, large heads, tiny bodies.
If I had a hit record, I'd have a big head myself. 
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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association
[This message was edited by Herb Steiner on 21 September 2006 at 11:45 AM.]
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Jesse Pearson
Member From: San Diego , CA
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posted 21 September 2006 11:46 AM
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Herb, we musta been posting at the same time. I agree with ya... |
Bill McCloskey
Member From:
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posted 21 September 2006 01:07 PM
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It is interesting no one spoke of the intonation and tuning. To my ear, either the steel was out of tune, especially on the low notes, or his intonation was off. My guess is that the guitar was out of tune, since his intonation seems dead on the higher notes, but way off on the bass strings. |
Jesse Pearson
Member From: San Diego , CA
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posted 21 September 2006 01:23 PM
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Bill, you must be cursed with perfect pitch! I have relative pitch and didn't have any problem with the instruments as far as transcribing. The bass was a stand up bass, those things are kinda hard when it comes to pitch? |
-Øystein Røysi
Member From: Trondheim, Norway
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posted 21 September 2006 01:28 PM
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No, Bill's right. I remember that when he went G-A-B-C on the bass strings on the steel, he was quite a bit flat on all of them. And yes I am blessed/cursed with near perfect pitch... My guess is that the strings were out of tune, since he doesn't miss on any other notes.------------------
Cheers,
Øystein
- Gold Tone Solid Spruce Weissenborn D / Low G / C+9
- National Dynamic A6th / C6th / Leavitt
- Fender SRV Strat
- Ayers Acoustic
- Koch Twintone II
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Jesse Pearson
Member From: San Diego , CA
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posted 22 September 2006 08:01 AM
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Oystein, could you please refer to the tab section and tell me what measure your talking about? Thanks... |
Ron Brennan
Member From: Edison, New Jersey, USA
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posted 22 September 2006 01:17 PM
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Last night, I played at and completed the final set of a series of Outdoor Car Shows.It was 58 degrees!! The steels were really cold. And the last song I played was, you guessed it, SLEEPWALK. In these parts and especially at car shows, it is the most requested and appreciated number. Amazin after all these years....Santo and Johnny, I owe you.......TX Someday, when I get brave (brazen) enough and figure out how to do it, I'll post my version of this Classic for fun and ridicule!  I play it in E6th.
Rgds, Ron
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JCFSGC member 2005 "Be of Good Cheer"
"55" Stringmaster D8,
"67" Telecaster,
"60"Fender Concert Amp 4-10's
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Derrick Mau
Member From: Honolulu, Hawaii, USA
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posted 22 September 2006 01:46 PM
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quote:
It is the most requested and appreciated number
I'll also stick my neck out on this and agree with you 100%. Whenever I play this song anywhere in public, it never fails to stop people in their tracks. It's got to be thee most recognizable steel solo ever.
Other songs just don't have that ability to grab people's attention. A simple melody, but very effective . . . only if you are able to nail down the feel and tone. |
Andy Sandoval
Member From: Bakersfield, California, USA
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posted 22 September 2006 02:09 PM
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Ron and Derrick, you guys are so right. I've played lots of tunes for family and friends but when I play that one I usually get a "hey, I know that one! by far, the most recognized steel tune. |
-Øystein Røysi
Member From: Trondheim, Norway
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posted 22 September 2006 04:27 PM
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Jesse,
Ehm... no, I'm sorry, I can't do that... I haven't said this before because it hasn't come up, but I'm blind, and the tab you posted was in picture form. But the measure I'm refering to is just before the second verse. But when I listen to it now, I can hear that there is more of the song that's slightly off pitch. After all, they were only human back then, too...------------------
Cheers,
Øystein
- Gold Tone Solid Spruce Weissenborn D / Low G / C+9
- National Dynamic A6th / C6th / Leavitt
- Fender SRV Strat
- Ayers Acoustic
- Koch Twintone II
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Jesse Pearson
Member From: San Diego , CA
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posted 22 September 2006 05:49 PM
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Oystein, if it's in the tab program that is used on the Olga guitar site, could you work with that? I was thinking I should do my tabs in the Olga program also because my server lost the "Twilight blues" by Dick McIntire I posted. I like the way the tab comes out better when I write it out, but it's a picture that can get lost unlike the Olga type Tab, which is less flexable. Jeff Au Hoy pointed out some changes for "Sleep Walk" that sound right on the money, so I re-wrote my original tab and will post it again when I get a new hard drive. |
-Øystein Røysi
Member From: Trondheim, Norway
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posted 22 September 2006 08:17 PM
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Jesse,
I'm afraid tab is a bit difficult. It's very hard to get an overview of it all, and it gets very much to remember for a whole song. This is actually a source of some frustration because I feel I'm not getting anywhere with my playing.But I won't bore you with my troubles. If I only sat down and practiced some more, I'm sure I'd improve... ------------------
Cheers,
Øystein
- Gold Tone Solid Spruce Weissenborn D / Low G / C+9
- National Dynamic A6th / C6th / Leavitt
- Fender SRV Strat
- Ayers Acoustic
- Koch Twintone II
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Jesse Pearson
Member From: San Diego , CA
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posted 23 September 2006 12:22 PM
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Ostein, what I was thinking is I know there is a program for the blind that can change writtings into spoken voice. I'm guessing thats what you use to read the SGF? Just thought maybe the program could be set up to read written tab to? You got it right however, it's the same for evrybody, practice, practice, practice!  [This message was edited by Jesse Pearson on 23 September 2006 at 12:23 PM.] |
-Øystein Røysi
Member From: Trondheim, Norway
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posted 23 September 2006 03:58 PM
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Hi Jesse,
Yes, I'm using a program which translates what's on the screen to synthetic speech, and Braille. However, written tab is a lot of information, and it's spread over several lines and columns. What this means is it gets hard to keep track of where you are on the "neck", and where in the song you're reading.But I have, as I said, near perfect pitch, so I have taken down many songs on the guitar just by ear. With enough practice I suppose I should be able to do this on the lap as well. ------------------
Cheers,
Øystein
- Gold Tone Solid Spruce Weissenborn D / Low G / C+9
- National Dynamic A6th / C6th / Leavitt
- Fender SRV Strat
- Ayers Acoustic
- Koch Twintone II
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