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raising the E to F#,which is something I wanted to try-mainly because I've always felt that P3 was somehow redundant

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If by redundant, you mean that by raising E to F# on a knee lever, and combining it with pedal A raising B to C# that you don't need pedal C(3) because you get the same notes, you are wrong. Pedal C is a floor pedal, and therefore has very quick response, allowing a wide range of classic licks. It will be hard to accomplish these licks using a vertical knee that has to be timed to move quickly in combination with pedals A and B. With that being said, if you have little interest in the classic pedal C sounds, then certainly you can dump the C pedal. But a big part of the famous Nashville E9 pedal steel sound that is rooted in the late 60's and 70's is pedal C.

FWIW, I have my "PF Pedal" on LKV.
(Lowers 5,6,10 a whole tone)

Going along with Jeff, it is extremely difficult (if not impossible) to do with a knee lever what B and C floor pedals can do. Best to leave them as is. Put the B to Bb change on that lever and you will probably like it once you get used to it.

Like anything else, there IS a learning curve. Particularly with an "UP" knee lever.

May Jesus bless you in your quests,

A lick where I use the PF is from AB pedals down, to Open, than a Whole Step Down, and back to Open. (with strings 4, 5, 6).

A song that come to mind is Dwight's "What Do You Know About Love", as a tag at the end of the solos.

It's so easy to play that with this setup - foot lifts off pedals, continues up to LKV, then back down.

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To further that,bOb,were you ever able to get your knee speed up to the point where you could do do what your foot could do?

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But I don't recommend that anyone follow my lead. It's pretty hard to hit a pedal and LKV together in a way that approximates the C pedal, and the C pedal is a staple of the E9th sound. I especially like the C pedal on push-pull guitars, becase you can use it with your 8th string lowered and the 4th string lower is ignored. It gives you a great sounding high 5th on the B9th chord.

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Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs, Open Hearts
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9),
Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
Roland Handsonic, Line 6 Variax

[This message was edited by Bobby Lee on 28 July 2003 at 11:16 AM.]

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Livin' in the Past and the Future with a 12 string Mooney Universal tuning.

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Whip Lashaway
Sierra E9/B6 12 string
Sierra E9/B6 14 string
78' Emmons D10 P/P

Regarding the LKV, mine raises the middle F# to G for that change mikd referred to giving a dominant 7 chord with A and B pedals engaged. That's a change I couldn't be without and it's completely natural in that position with your feet already mashing down on A and B, just push a little harder and you engage LKV. I also raise #1 to G for another voicing of the dom 7.

I lower the Bs to Bbs via the RKR. A pretty nice change tho I don't use it all that much. Gives you an augmented chord with the A pedal.

I dispensed with the C pedal about the first week I took up pedal steel and haven't found a reason to add it back. It just seemed to me that the necessity of adding the E to F# change with pedals A and B engaged trumped any
reason not to have it. Of course I didn't have a C6 neck and needed that additional 6th voicing. (I still don't have the C6 neck as I play a S12U guitar.) I raise E to F# on string 4--it's located on my RKL. It
also adds a cool 9th tone to the open chord. Of course it's the same note as the first string which I do have and use plenty for passing tones, plus it makes a nice unison sound when you pedal string 4 up to the same tone as string 1. Works real nice at the first major chord inversion of up 3 from root where you have string 4 already raised to F--another sus 4 voicing that also unisons
string 1.

I can't see how I'm handicapped not having this change on the floor. Not only can you get the same change as the C pedal, you can add the A pedal raise for a dom 7 add 6 chord (A+B pedals down).

I just recently have been exploiting the E to D (string 8) change my with pedal 6 out of root position (E9 mode). This change creates the 4 chord+dom. 7 when in the B6 orientation (both Es lowered) but in the E9 zone (root pos.), its a kinda cool dom7. Very twangy and great for blues licks.

I almost forgot--with E to F# on RKL, I can get the "Moonglow" lick quite easily playing that triad on strings 3-4-5, moving the bar down one, then two frets while keeping string 4 at the same pitch via the two raises for E
(the raise to F and the raise to F#.)

No I don't need my toe on the floor, I just raise my entire foot off the floor.

I had that on my Zum (5,6,10 on LKV), too.

I asked Jeff Peterson to put the same thing on my LeGrande last week, but he persuaded me to split the change - lower the 6th on the LKV (like normal) and extend the range of my Bs to Bb (RKL) so that I can go the whole step down, and use the LKV and RKL together.

I was afraid that I wouldn't get sufficient 'feel' on the half-step (I use that ALL the time), but he told me not to worry - he set the guitar up perfectly, and I'm already completely comfortable with 'half-pedalling' that RKL. It's entirely due to Jeff's expert balancing of the C6/E9 pulls on that lever - I wouldn't have believed it could feel so easy!

My Emmons is now the perfect steel guitar !