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Author
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Topic: My New/Old Sho~Bud LDG
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Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 11 June 2004 07:58 PM
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Well I've been looking for one of these First year Sho~bud LDG's for myself, for almost 15 years and I finally found one thanks to a very Dear Friend.
I just finished taking it all apart and cleaning/polishing every part and new pad and as many changes I can think of for 3 pedals 4 knee levers; just to see what a barrel tuning system could possibly do, and WhaaaLaaa she's perfect and I OWN it..ha.
Here's the set up on it.
nickle E9th P1 P2 P3 LKL LKR RKL RKR
.013p F# G/G#
.015p D# E D/C#
.012p G# A
.014p E F# F Eb
.018p B C# C#
.020p G# A F#
.026w F# G/G#
.030w E F Eb
.034w D C#
.038w B C#
She's a 1973 Sho~bud LDG Model with barrel tuners behind two hole pullers on cross-shafts. Single raise/single lower fingers that will raise and lower as many times you want with barrels down the rod and to me; is the smoothest system ever on a Shobud. Original White background Shobud fretboard and original Shobud pickup with coil tap 19K/11K....yeee haaaa I'm one happy camper.
Any questions??
More pics here> In the House of Wood
Ricky[This message was edited by Ricky Davis on 11 June 2004 at 08:12 PM.] |
Ron Whitworth
Member From: Yuma,Ariz. USA
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posted 11 June 2004 08:37 PM
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CONGRATULATIONS Ricky!!!!!!!!!!!
It looks just like brand new man..You sure do beautiful work..Enjoy it now..
Thanks for the pictures...Ron |
James Morehead
Member From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA
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posted 11 June 2004 10:14 PM
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That LDG is pretty as a speckled pup!! I'll bet you, you are the only one on the planet with an original white fretboard on a first year LDG!! Anyone else out there with a guitar like this? That's what I thought! 
SO, WHAT ARE YOU GONNA NAME THIS ONE, Ricky?!?!
OK, Who's got a cool name for this guitar? (and NOT "Green Darlin'" OK?, Well Maybe!! HA!!) |
Herman Visser
Member From: Rohnert Park, California, USA
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posted 11 June 2004 10:29 PM
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Ricky. That is sweat! have a question for you, if I water and feed my little Maverick long enough will it grow up to look like that.Also, found your web page the other day great stuff.If your ever on the west coast,N.Cal please post would like to hear you in preson |
richard burton
Member From: Britain
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posted 12 June 2004 12:17 AM
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Ricky,
I'm looking to add the seventh string raise to G#, and I notice that you do it on the RKR, along with the second and ninth string lowers. Can you tell me the advantages of putting it there, it seems like a good idea,
Cheers, R B. |
David L. Donald
Member From: Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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posted 12 June 2004 01:53 AM
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Ricky Glad you got such a sweet machine.
I know you have been running on borrowed hardware a few weeks now.
But to get this one must really be a hoot for you.
I also notice a very interesting RKR.... cool,.
How do those double splits work for minor? accurate enough?
Peep on kickin'[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 12 June 2004 at 01:55 AM.]
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Tony Prior
Member From: Charlotte NC
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posted 12 June 2004 03:31 AM
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Ricky..let me borrow it for a year or two..I'll let you know how it plays  !!!congrats..it's a beauty.. t |
Fred Martin
Member From: Flagstaff, Arizona,USA
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posted 12 June 2004 06:57 AM
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What a deal ! From the pictures Id guess the guitar is just as happy with its new found home as you are ! Sure love to hear you play this one. |
Bill Miller
Member From: Gaspé, Québec, Canada
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posted 12 June 2004 07:40 AM
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Great looking guitar Ricky and you've got her glittering like stardust as usual. Makes me a bit lonesome for my old Sho-Bud. I have a question. It's an S10 on a double frame with a pad and I hadn't realized those were made as far back as 1973. So I'm wondering, when did they start offering S10s on double bodies with pads, and who was the first manufacturer to do that? |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 12 June 2004 09:31 AM
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quote:
and I notice that you do it on the RKR, along with the second and ninth string lowers. Can you tell me the advantages of putting it there, it seems like a good idea
Richard that is a nice place for that change as with the half stop feel I have set up on this; it makes for a possitive minor 3rd tone along with a flat7th tone for the 7th and 2nd string and is too cool man. Also in the pedal down position bending in and out of the major7th tone from the 6th tone is greatly needed as I can immulate some playability from the C6th pedal change; and of course the half feel raise on the 7th string for the flat 7th note with the root tone still in the chord on the 6th string; that you loose when You just lower the 6th string to the flat 7th tone in the pedal down position. So that's a start of the explaination; but I'd have to sit down and show you the bazzillion other things you can do..ha.
quote:
How do those double splits work for minor? accurate enough?
David all splits and half tone feels are awesome on this barrel tuning system. As I've messed with this system for a long time, I've figured out how to get a string to move faster or slower by the tension of the lower spring on one and maybe not on another and wheather a raise spring is on a finger or not...
Take for instance; the RKL I have set up on here and the 1st string must raise very quickly as it takes much more to raise the 1st string along with the half tone raise on 2nd string and the full tone lower on 6th. I have it time just perfect to where there is a perfect half tone feel on the 1st string when the barrels hit the fingers for the 2nd string and 6th string; and I have a extra barrel on the string raise part of the puller for that knee lever which gives me a perfect tunable split...yeeehaaa and they all feel perfect.
quote:
I have a question. It's an S10 on a double frame with a pad and I hadn't realized those were made as far back as 1973. So I'm wondering, when did they start offering S10s on double bodies with pads, and who was the first manufacturer to do that?
Bill the very first LDG that was made for production as a single E9 on a double body with pad; was indeed Lloyd Green's original Shobud LDG that he plays even today; and that was made in 1973. There was a prototype of this idea that Lloyd had Shot take off the C6 neck and mechanics of a Baldwin crossover that he had prior to that; and put a pad on it....and that was the inspiration to the production of the "LDG". The only other Steels that I know about is the Marlen and Leonard also made a Single-10 on a double body with full pad in the early 70's; but I can't speak for any other manufactures; as I just don't know. Shobud did make a Single-10 Professional which had a half size ledge on it; that I've seen some put a pad there; but not full size pad.
Thanks everyone for the kind words; I'm diggin' this Shobud.
Ricky |
Loren Morehouse
Member From: Meadowlands, MN USA
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posted 12 June 2004 09:43 AM
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Nice piano Ricky, wish it was mine!! They're so damn purdy!! Loren. |
Jeff Agnew
Member From: Dallas, TX
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posted 12 June 2004 11:07 AM
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Ricky,Something I've always been curious about -- why did Sho~Bud always mount the LKL crossrod at an angle? I had guessed on D-10s it was because of space concerns but that's not the case here. Then I thought it might be to match the movement arc of your left knee, but that would be exactly opposite of the way the lever is mounted. Also, why the extra-long crossrod on RKL? I figured Guru MaharishiShoBud would know the Divine answers to these and other great mysteries |
David Biagini
Member From: San Jose, CA, USA
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posted 12 June 2004 07:49 PM
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That's a real beauty, Ricky. Congratulations. You certainly have a way with Sho Buds. |
Damir Besic
Member From: La Vergne,TN
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posted 12 June 2004 09:00 PM
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the best sounding Sho~Buds definetly are LDG (IMHO)DB |
Al Marcus
Member From: Cedar Springs,MI USA
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posted 12 June 2004 09:23 PM
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Ricky-Beautiful guitar and great job you did on it. And , along with you, I like those barrel tuners. But I know I can't get them adjusted as nicely as you do....al  ------------------
My Website..... www.cmedic.net/~almarcus/ |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 13 June 2004 12:09 AM
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Thanks guys.
Jeff actually if you sit at the angle most players sit at; which is your chest is pointing more towards the left....>then you will see that your leg actually moves left and towards the back a little as opposed to straight sideways..>so with that LKL angled that bit...Makes for a square hit on the knee.
And that extra crossbar on the RKL is also the mount for the lever as it sits on that ledge and the crossbar for the pullers is below that; so now you have all for knees mounted on the ledge and so they are the same height....yeee haaaa.
Ricky |
CrowBear Schmitt
Member From: Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France
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posted 13 June 2004 01:24 AM
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as usual Ricky, you've done plenty a good !
David D and i were discussin' your copedent
on the ^fone last nite and of course we'll cop as much as we can from it ! Hah ! |
David L. Donald
Member From: Koh Samui Island, Thailand
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posted 13 June 2004 01:59 AM
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Yep... HAH.
I really likethe combination Minor7 lever with stops that becomes a 6 chord.
That is a really cool logic.
And it also has the Hughy change on the other direction.Also that F# on RKL seems a different take on the Franklin/Emmons change. I have something similar on opposite knees, but I think I will definitely get another half stop mechanism for the lower string and try this out.. You seem to have found a great deal of power from a 3 R 2 L changer.
Good on you dude!![This message was edited by David L. Donald on 13 June 2004 at 02:01 AM.] |
richard burton
Member From: Britain
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posted 13 June 2004 04:39 AM
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Thanks for the reply Ricky, I will put the 7th raise on my RKR and give it a try.
Cheers, R B
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Tony Prior
Member From: Charlotte NC
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posted 13 June 2004 05:07 AM
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Hey Ricky, I use my 7th string raise along with the 1st string raise for extended phrasing, both on the same lever..RKL, I am thinking it would not be possible to do these extended phrases with the changes on split levers..no ? Thoughts on this ?Am I Nuts ? or , am I...Nuts ? Lately I have been using the 7th string raise phrasing along with 9th string lower phrasing and have become very attached to the tonality..even using them to replace AB Pedal phrasing.. It's a "brave new world" down there on them lower strings for sure.. note of topic.Using the 7th string raise out of non pedal positons along with B pedal "Activity" I have been playing Telecaster B Bender style licks trading/repeating/copying almost the same licks with our very fine Guitar player ...hows that for a reversing the scenario..it's great bandstand fun..and I usually tell Matt.."hey buddy I can do that but you can't do this ! "... happy sunday t |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 13 June 2004 11:59 AM
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No your not nuts Tony..ha.
Almost whatever you do with one thing; you will not be able to do a few other way...
I use the 1 and 7th string raise differently and not in unison...so I don't bother me the way they are set up. Heck I change my copedent around about every two weeks anyway....so you never know what I'll have in the near future..ha...but it keeps me thinking and always exploring new stuff to keep fresh.
Ricky |
Jeff Agnew
Member From: Dallas, TX
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posted 14 June 2004 05:20 AM
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quote:
...which is your chest is pointing more towards the left....>then you will see that your leg actually moves left and towards the back a little as opposed to straight sideways.
Yeah, that was my first guess. It's mounted that way on my Pro II but I've never found it to be an advantage. And it makes you wonder why, if they believed in the theory, they didn't angle the LKR in the opposite direction. Also, unless my eyesight is even worse than I think, that's a pedal rod connector used to join the LKL crossrod ball joint to the pulling rod, eh? Sweet. Much better than the factory linkage on my Pro II. |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 14 June 2004 07:39 AM
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Yes your eyes are correct; that is a pedal rod connector on one side and that plastic connector on the other. Those plastic connectors can strip or break and this one had a broken one when I got it; so I put the pedal rod connector on as it will grab that ball piece just fine> works real good.
Ricky |
Greg Vincent
Member From: Los Angeles, CA USA
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posted 14 June 2004 11:53 AM
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CONGRATULATIONS RICKY!!!I notice that you are lowering string six a whole tone and therefore have moved away from a wound string in that location. What made you decide to go that route? Also, do you find a 20P is less "plunky" than a 22P? -GV P.S. Why not come out to L.A. with Dale in July just for kicks??? Please???[This message was edited by Greg Vincent on 14 June 2004 at 11:53 AM.] |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 14 June 2004 01:15 PM
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Hey Greg I do like the wound 6th string more than a plain; but I've been experimenting with some stuff and lowering the 6th a whole tone with a tunable split is something I'm diggin' right now. I'll probably end up going back; but I also find that there aren't as many unpleasent "tuning overtones" on the shorter scale Shobud as opposed to a longer scale pedal steel; for that plain 6th and Of course I'm obsessive about tuning and changing strings, so I'm just not haven't the "I hate the plain 6th string" thing I used to..ha.
I haven't tried the .022 plain yet..cause I ain't got any..ha....
Come out to Cali. with Dale for kicks??? ha....I think NOT.....
I would like to come to california; but not with Dale; that tour is just too painful and is designed for either a fall down drunk or a 20 year old that has no cares in the world and has no life to care about in the first place...>and I'm neither.
Ricky |
Kevin Mincke
Member From: Farmington, MN (Twin Cities-South Metro) USA
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posted 14 June 2004 01:24 PM
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Boy.....those ol' Sho~Buds! Gotta love em' |
Doc Hall
Member From: League City, Texas, USA
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posted 15 June 2004 09:11 AM
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I had a similar Bud and have to agree that the old barrel pulling system was smooth as silk. It had a real machine feel to it. I also thought it tuned pretty smoothly. To me, most of the newer guitars have a "notchy" feel to them when tuning with your pedals down. This old Bud system was real smooth. |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 15 June 2004 10:07 PM
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Doc; I have to agree totally. When the rod is affixed to the puller(bell crank) and the nylon tuner on the other side, like most all modern all pull pedal steels...>there is a small amount of flex in the rod when engaged. This will always feel a little stiffer and sometimes you'll feel the notchy feeling when pushing the pedal very slowly. This barrel tuning system is smooth as silk and you feel nothing but the string raising or lowering with your foot or knee all the way up and down at any speed. It is the small spring in the middle of the barrel that get's rid of any flex as small as it might be; and that is why I believe this to be the smoothest system out there; and eventhough it's the OLD single raise/single lower fingers...you can see from my copedent above that it can do anything any modern design changer can do, including split tune...ah..ha...
Ricky |
Joe A. Camacho
Member From: San Diego, CA
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posted 16 June 2004 06:06 AM
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I have to say that I agree, my LDG is my favorite guitar to play right now, the pedals feel so much smoother than my Professional...  |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 16 June 2004 08:05 PM
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Just Awesome Joe; I forgot just how beautiful yours is; you lucky dog.
Well last night I played with Redd; and after a couple songs he came over and said: "Ricky that is the best one yet" he said: "that LDG your playing has the best sound of all the shobuds I've heard you play; don't change a thing on it"...
So there ya have it; two thumbs up from the Man himself, who actually just got home from a slew of recordings with the great Lloyd Green. So to have that come out of his mouth and the smiles that followed for the rest of the night; well I believe I found my Steel.
Ricky[This message was edited by Ricky Davis on 16 June 2004 at 08:06 PM.] |
John Troutman
Member From: New Haven, CT
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posted 16 June 2004 08:11 PM
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I was able to drop by Ego's to see Ricky and Redd for half a set last night. Boy, let me tell you. That is an incredible guitar. And you should have heard Ricky jammin' the songs he normally plays on the C6 neck on that LDG E9. Unbelievable... It couldn't be in better hands...
John |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 17 June 2004 09:14 AM
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Thanks John for your kind and encouraging words. It is quite a task to immulate on the E9th what I would normally play on the C6th; but I'm diggin' it and it just makes more sense to me on the E9 than it EVER did the c6th anyway and this knee lever configuation I have set up on this LDG really makes it a breeze...ha....
Ricky |
Rick McDuffie
Member From: Smithfield, North Carolina, USA
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posted 17 June 2004 08:41 PM
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The mechanics on those guitars are beautifully simple. I like it when you can raise the hood and see the carburetor, distributor and radiator right off... rather than a mass of machinery. Makes them easier to work on, too.Ricky, you should be playing a LDG, given your respect for/debt to the man. You're one of the ones bearing his legacy. Rick |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 17 June 2004 10:09 PM
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Thanks Brother Rick and that is exactly why I've been looking for one of these for 15 years. Lloyd Green is "The Reason" I play steel guitar; as I have many influenses, but it was the sound that Lloyd put out and the dynamics and dexterity of this playing that encouraged me to want to make that sound myself. To play a Sho~Bud LDG is a dedication to his Legacy and a pat on his back; and I hope to do that for a long long time.
Ricky |
Rick Schmidt
Member From: Carlsbad, CA. USA
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posted 18 June 2004 08:02 AM
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Real purty Ricky! |
Stephen Gambrell
Member From: Ware Shoals, South Carolina, USA
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posted 24 June 2004 07:03 PM
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A beautiful guitar, as we would expect, and considering your medical condition, Ricky, it HAD to be a labor of love! I've developed tennis elbow/repetetive stress injury in my right elbow, had to get the cortisone shots yesterday, and I've gotta work 3-12 hour days tomorrow, Sat., and Sunday. Turning wrenches, doing ekectrical and mechanical maintenance work in a manufacturing plant. I'm already hurting thinking about it--then two days off, work two night shifts, and gigs Friday on electric guitar, and Saturday playing bluegrass--so my hat, as well as most of my hair , is off to you, dude! |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 24 June 2004 11:59 PM
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Thanks Stephen; and my Hat is right back off to ya, for what you gotta do too. Sometimes ya just DO IT eh?
Ricky |
Stephen Gambrell
Member From: Ware Shoals, South Carolina, USA
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posted 25 June 2004 02:31 AM
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Yep, ya JUST DO IT! And believe me, that eketrical work ain't easy!! |
Joe Henry
Member From: Ebersberg, Germany
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posted 26 June 2004 02:47 PM
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I´m so glad for you Ricky, you really do deserve to own a great guitar like that. That setup just seems the most logical way to get as many useful changes as posslble with four levers. But isn´t there a lot of tension on the right knees, with three pulls each? But maybe not, from what you said about the barrel system. I have a strong liking for it too, the Professional is still doing great. I don´t even want a nylon tuner guitar anymore. Maybe some day I´d like to check out one of those bellcrank-and-barrel-Pro-II´s.Have fun, Joe |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 26 June 2004 06:48 PM
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Hey Joe; thanks pal for the kind words.
Yes three pulls on the RKR can be stiff on a Rack and Barrel; but diffinatly not on the Barrel tuners behind pullers....it's so easy and smooth, and I'm also not pulling anything on a C neck either..ah...ha.
I am loving this set up; I haven't even changed anything around yet and that's not like me..ha...
I'm finding I can play most all my swing changes I normally do on the C6th neck, on this set up and I just found some more stuff earlier today at our gig..ha....
More stuff to come too...I just see this neck so much better for theory; than I ever did on the C6th neck...I'm diggin' it.
Joe; you would love the way a early pro II or first year LDG would feel with barrel tuners behind pullers.....Just awesome.
Also; you could certainly do it with that Professional....>send it to me and I'll put crossbars with pullers in there and it would be just like a early pro II....>but it will cost ..ha..
Ricky
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