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Author
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Topic: Recording steel guitar
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Drew Howard
Member From: Mason, MI, U.S.A.
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posted 06 November 2004 12:04 PM
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Two things:1. What is a good pre-amp to record with? More of my sessions are going direct w/o an amp, and I need something that will send a hot signal. 2. Twice now I've recorded tracks, had a piano (electric) added later, and find I'm out of tune with the track, especially the E9 high G#. Next time I will tune it straight up. Drew ------------------
Fessenden D-10 8+8 / Magnatone S-8 (E13)
[This message was edited by Drew Howard on 06 November 2004 at 12:05 PM.]
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Ron Randall
Member From: Dallas, Texas, USA
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posted 06 November 2004 03:40 PM
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A Peavey VMP-2 preamp is very nice. You can find them used on Ebay sometimes. Built like a tank (I like that) all tubes, no nonsense.
It has 2 channels, Treble and Bass EQ if you need it. Lately been going for $700 to $1000.
Consider using a mic on your amp instead of going direct.
Working with a keyboard/piano is sometimes difficult. Real pianos are not always in tune. Pianos and keyboards are not tuned ET over the full range of 88 keys. The higher notes are tuned sharp to ET and the lower notes are tuned flat to ET. hope this helps a bit. Ron |
Larry Bell
Member From: Englewood, Florida
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posted 06 November 2004 04:27 PM
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Drew,
The preamp thing is a matter of taste. Just lately I've been using one of Brad's Black Boxes and a Boss GT-6 and getting the best direct recorded sound I ever have. Most of the stuff on my new CD was recorded that way.When time and space allow, I like a mic too, especially in stereo with one mic close and a second 3' or so away. Either two condenser mics or a 57 on the edge of the cone and a condenser for the room mic. Ah, TUNING! what a novel subject
I always ask to add my part AFTER any keyboard part has been recorded -- or else at the same time. If I can hear the target, I can hit it. I'm flying blind, intonation-wise, if I don't know what I'm shooting for. ------------------
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps |
Dan Tyack
Member From: Seattle, WA USA
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posted 06 November 2004 09:53 PM
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I absolutely never record direct unless forced to. If I need to, a Pod isn't bad. ------------------
www.tyack.com
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Dan Tyack
Member From: Seattle, WA USA
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posted 06 November 2004 09:54 PM
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Oh yeah, in terms of intunation, it's usually best to record at the same time or after the piano. If not, make your part as simple and as in the pocket as you can, so as to make the piano sound out of tune.------------------
www.tyack.com
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Billy McCoy
Member From: Arlington, Texas, USA
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posted 08 November 2004 10:58 PM
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Drew,I usally insist on miking my Steel amp...
but in cases where the studio is too small or you have to be direct because the lack of iso-booths. The LINE 6 POD XT is the way to go!
Great sounding direct tone. b ------------------
MSA Millennium D10, Walker Stereo Steel, Stone Tree Custom Tele, LINE 6 Vetta II and POD XT PRO |
Mark Krutke
Member From: Tomahawk, WI USA
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posted 08 November 2004 11:20 PM
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Hi Drew,The Shure 57 has given me the best results. At times I run it through a Presonus TubePre to boost the signal and make the tone a tad warmer. As for tuning, I'll tune all the strings sharp just a tad except for the G#'s, which would stay around 440. The C#'s (pedal depressed) will be tuned just a little flat. Playing with a 5-piece group and 3 part harmony, that has worked for me.
C6th stays pretty much 440. mark ------------------
www.authenticrecording.com |
Willis Vanderberg
Member From: Bradenton, FL, USA
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posted 09 November 2004 08:26 PM
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what Larry Said..Black Box, Hilton Pedal |
Billy Woo
Member From: Los Angeles, CA, USA
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posted 10 November 2004 07:09 AM
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I just had a recording session in Hollywood last night and the engineer had me go direct to his board (Trident) at first I was reluctant to go direct but he asked me to try it and it worked out, the sound was clean, full and he tweaked it with his compressor and added a small bit of effects and it sounded great. I must admit that I personally like the warm sound of a tube amp or my Webb for that matter but sometimes you gotta compromise, I reckon.Bronco Billy
Zumsteel U-12 |
Mark van Allen
Member From: loganville, Ga. USA
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posted 10 November 2004 08:40 AM
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Hi, Drew- I had an article in the second issue of Pedal Steel.US magazine, which you can still get as a single copy at: http://pedalsteel.us/ It went into some of the many variations on studio recording for Steel, amps, micing, pre-amp direct, etc. I can send you a word doc without photos if you'd like. It's a pretty personal path, with some folks happy with preamps and recording direct, and others who always use an amp and a favorite microphone. It takes some experimentation to find what makes you most happy with your own sound, for sure.------------------
Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
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Mark van Allen
Member From: loganville, Ga. USA
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posted 10 November 2004 08:42 AM
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On your question number 1, I've had really good results with Peavey's transtubefex, profex II (although you may have to play around with the input/output levels to mimimize noise), and line 6 POD. With the transtube Fex, I have separate banks for studio with different balance settings from the live patches. |
Dave Grafe
Member From: Portland, Oregon, USA
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posted 12 November 2004 12:08 PM
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"...If I need to, a Pod isn't bad..."
I bought a Pod but couldn't can't find a clean enough tone to suit me.
I generally do record direct, it allows me to sit in the control room and simplifies monitoring and communication with the engineer, producer, etc.
I have done pro audio for a living for the last twenty-odd years - in both live and recording venues - and have a lot of pretty esoteric toys available to me on a daily basis.
After many years of experimenting using Fender Twin/Super Reverb, Roland JC 120, Peavey Session, Nashville, etc. I have settled on the following with MOST EXCELLENT results. So good in fact that I almost always go direct to the console without a D.I. at live gigs as well:
Audio Arts 4100 4-band Parametric EQ / Preamp(precise, sweet and oh so smooth)
Audio Arts 1200 Compressor (could be dbx 160X, Ashley SC50, UREI LA22, there's lots of good choices here)
Roland SDE2500 Digital Delay (or TC Electronics D-Two, either of them fully programmable for echo, double, chorus, flange, etc.)
Yamaha REV7 (I used to use a Lexicon PCM 70, PCM 60, Yamaha SPX90II - IMHO the REV 7 "Strings" program is the best ever for PSG, incredibly smooth)
Direct feed to the console out of the REV7's XLR outputs, 1/4" outs goes to a Nashville 400 (mono) or Crown D150 and JBL D130F (stereo) speaker cabs (or a pair of passive full range wedges) for stage sound.
I haven't played with the "Black Box" yet, maybe Larry Behm will give me a crack at it as he has been raving over it of late. The Audio Arts 4100 is the best preamp I have ever used for PSG, a lot of units would probably sound pretty good in the signal chain after that.
That's my story and I'm stuck with it.
Dave ------------------
Strung Out on Great Sounds
www.pdxaudio.com/dgbio |
Grant Johnson
Member From: Nashville TN
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posted 12 November 2004 12:31 PM
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If you have to go direct...
I like the clean "Blackface" tones on the Johnson J-Station over the Line6 POD. I have owned both and A/B'ed them extensively on six-string and PSG...
My $.02.
YMMV.
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Dave Grafe
Member From: Portland, Oregon, USA
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posted 12 November 2004 12:45 PM
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This is beginning to turn into an "Electronics" string - at least my part of it I'm afraid . . . ------------------
Strung Out on Great Sounds
pdxaudio.com/dgbio
[This message was edited by Dave Grafe on 12 November 2004 at 12:49 PM.] [This message was edited by Dave Grafe on 12 November 2004 at 12:50 PM.] [This message was edited by Dave Grafe on 12 November 2004 at 12:52 PM.]
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Klaus Caprani
Member From: Copenhagen, Denmark
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posted 12 November 2004 12:55 PM
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Just had my very first live-studiosession yesterday. Though I told them that it might be a problem they insisted on trying the take with a lineup consisting of Steel, Mandolin, Drums and bowed upright Bass.
We spent a few takes trying to nail the intonation before the producer gave in to my suggestion of playing an acoustic guitar for cue purposes.
The first take after that was bought.By the way I went line in at this occasion, but wasn't quite comfortable with it. I normally record line in through a TLA 5050 tube amp/compressor in my homestudio, but there might have been some impedance issues at the studio causing my volume-pedal to feel nothing like I was used to.
It sounded better in the monitors than in the headphones though. ------------------
Klaus Caprani MCI RangeXpander S-10 3x4
www.klauscaprani.com |
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