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Author
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Topic: Replacing Kluson Deluxe with Gotoh. Push/pull.
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Charles Dempsey
Member From: The Cradle of the Stars.
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posted 05 February 2006 05:43 PM
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Well, I did it.My Gotohs arrived last week, and Saturday night I got up the gumption to tackle the job.
Here you can see the screws that hold the C6 Keystock on. I had to remove one of my LKL brackets to get at the lower left screw.  Here's what the guitar looks like with the C6 keystock missing.  The C6 keystock ready to be operated on.  Four new tuners are installed.  New tuners are installed and the C6 keystock has been reinstalled on the guitar. The Gotoh tuners are a direct replacement for the Kluson Deluxe but have a higher ratio. No problems at all with the install. I didn't even drop one of the fiddley little screws. By my timing this is a 2 hour and 3 beer job. Plus months to get psyched up for it of course  . If anyone wants one left and one right Gotoh let me know. That way you only have to buy 3 sets of tuners. $10.00 plus $1.00 for 1st class mail ought to cover it in the Continental US. Now I've got to re-string the rascal. I'll make further reports as warranted. Charlie |
Charles Dempsey
Member From: The Cradle of the Stars.
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posted 08 February 2006 05:50 PM
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I strung the guitar up Sunday evening, and I've been playing it every night. So far I really like the Gotohs. They were a little stiff at first, but got easier to turn with use. The tuning is very stable, and the keys are much easier to turn than the Klusons: I no longer have to use the speed tuner as a wrench to raise the pitch when tuning.Color me tickled pink. Now I gotta change my setup  . Charlie[This message was edited by Charles Dempsey on 08 February 2006 at 05:57 PM.] |
Steven Black
Member From: Gahanna, Ohio, USA
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posted 18 February 2006 05:27 AM
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Hello Charles, what company did you order your Gotoh's from? steveb. |
Jay Ganz
Member From: Out Behind The Barn
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posted 18 February 2006 06:53 AM
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Why did you have to take the whole thing off
just to replace the tuners? |
Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 18 February 2006 06:55 AM
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Jay,
I had the same thought! But then I read that Charles replaced the tuners on the C6th neck and those inside tuners (next to the E9th neck) would be a bugger to get at without taking off the keyhead. Stewart-MacDonald is a good source for these tuners. Part No. 0933 www.stewmac.com
Erv[This message was edited by Erv Niehaus on 18 February 2006 at 06:57 AM.] [This message was edited by Erv Niehaus on 18 February 2006 at 07:01 AM.] [This message was edited by Erv Niehaus on 18 February 2006 at 07:02 AM.] |
Charles Dempsey
Member From: The Cradle of the Stars.
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posted 18 February 2006 07:31 AM
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Steven, I got them from Stewart McDonald. They had the best price by far. Cost was $25.86 each, or $103.44 for four sets plus $11.25 SH. See them at; http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tuners/Guitar,_solid_peghead/1/Gotoh_Vintage-style_Oval_Knob_Tuners.html Jay, I don't believe you can get the tuners off the high side of the C6 keyhead without removing it. In fact, you might not be able to get the tuners off the low side of the E9 keyhead either. It'd be darn hard to get at those little screws too. In any case it was a lot easier to remove the keystock than it looks. Erv, thanks for the encouragement, links and advice. I'd never have had the courage to do it without your recommendations. Charlie |
David Nugent
Member From: Gum Spring, Va.
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posted 19 February 2006 03:42 AM
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I recently performed the same upgrade on my P/P. One of the keyheads must be moved to enable you to slide the old tuners out and install the new ones, they are just too close together to do otherwise. It may be possible to remove two of the screws, loosen the third, and swing the keyhead aside, but after going that far it seems just as simple to completely remove one keyhead or the other.(IMO).... (Just a thought, I only ordered three sets of new keys and by checking the two sets of existing keys, found two that were still quite functional from the C6 side and used them to complete the project thus saving the cost of an entire new set.) |
Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 19 February 2006 06:55 AM
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Charlie,
You're sure welcome. It's sure fun to work on those old girls, isn't it?? I guess when you get right down to it, maybe I'm a better "mechanic" than "musician"! 
Erv |
Jon Light
Member From: Brooklyn, NY
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posted 19 February 2006 07:02 AM
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The first time I ever saw a p/p close up was when UPS delivered one a few years ago. I was pretty disappointed in the quality of those tuners. The amount of slop in the mechanism is amazing. Is that your main reason for doing this upgrade?
I assume that the shaft length and the amount of threading for the post nuts are all just right for this to drop right in, right? You've got me thinking about upgrading my SD-12.
I really appreciate your effort in presenting this tutorial. Thanks mucho.
----and btw, I'm budgeting 4 hours and 6 beers. But then, with every beer after the first three, you gotta add another half hour to fix your screw-ups from the previous hour, and then you gotta buy yourslef another beer so.....this thing may take a while. To complete and to sleep off.[This message was edited by Jon Light on 19 February 2006 at 07:05 AM.]
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Charles Dempsey
Member From: The Cradle of the Stars.
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posted 19 February 2006 08:03 AM
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Another forum member, wish I could remember who, told me how to find the keyhead screws and what they looked like. He also said that when he did the tuner upgrade he removed the E9 keyhead first, and then found that he couldn't get the tuners off the high side of the C6 neck because of the step between necks.Jon, the Gotohs are exactly the same dimension as the Klusons in every respect. You will re-use the tuner screws because the ones Gotoh supplies are wood screws. The Gotoh post bushings are not needed. Charlie[This message was edited by Charles Dempsey on 19 February 2006 at 08:07 AM.] |
Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 20 February 2006 09:44 AM
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And for goodness sake, don't lose any of those little screws!!! When I did my last p/p, I lost one of the little screws and Ron Lashley was good enough to send me a replacement. I couldn't find them anyplace. They are some little suckers!
Erv |
Bob Hoffnar
Member From: Brooklyn, NY
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posted 20 February 2006 10:02 AM
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I have had more than a few conversations with PP players who insist that the newer tuners that work better don't sound the same as the old style ones. Bruce Zumsteg has done a bunch of work on the subject. I know he offers different types of tuners on his hybred model guitar. I can't remember all the details at the moment though.------------------
Bob
upcoming gigs
My Website 
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D Schubert
Member From: Columbia, MO, USA
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posted 20 February 2006 02:23 PM
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I just did the same replacement on my S-10 Emmons. Didn't have to remove the keystock, and it was no more than a two beer job. The only difference that I can find is that the guitar is easier to tune now. The keys that were on it previously were the keystone-button Gibson style, and -- even with some in poor condition -- I sold 'em to a local guitar tech who plans to use them to repair Les Pauls & such that come through his shop. Net cost to me was the two beers. |
Charles Dempsey
Member From: The Cradle of the Stars.
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posted 21 February 2006 08:26 AM
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quote:
the newer tuners that work better don't sound the same as the old style ones.
Maybe by the time they're as worn out as the old klusons they will . The world is a mysterious place to some people. A butterfly lighting on the left front leg would make the guitar sound different. Charlie |
Herb Steiner
Member From: Cedar Valley, Travis County TX
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posted 21 February 2006 09:42 AM
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quote:
A butterfly lighting on the left front leg would make the guitar sound different.
Especially if it was a black butterfly. ------------------
Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association
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Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 21 February 2006 12:49 PM
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I think where you hold your tongue in your mouth would make a bigger difference in the sound than the tuners!!!  |
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