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Author | Topic: Buddy Holly |
Robert Member From: Champaign, IL |
![]() Can't recall ever having seen a thread on Buddy - which is a little surprising, what with all the Texans we have here . . . so - how about it? Some of you older guys may have been to see him, may have known him or his family, maybe you were playing some of the same shows. I imagine he would have gone on to be a producer/impresario-type, writing songs for his proteges, owning his own label, and creating pop music with the best of them. What do you think? Rob |
Michael Johnstone Member From: Sylmar,Ca. USA |
![]() These "what if?" things are always fun.My guess is he probably would have become a mainstream country artist by the late 60s and into the 70s and would by now,if still living,would be revered by oldtimers but considered old hat in Nashville and would probably be playing Branson and Vegas w/no record deal. |
Gene Jones Member From: Oklahoma City, OK USA |
![]() .....or maybe a record & souvenir store down on music row!..... |
Mel Culbreath Member From: Waynesville, NC, USA |
![]() I would agree with Michael on this. Just want to mention that I saw The Crickets last Wednesday when they opened for the Everly Brothers at Wolftrap Park near DC. They sounded great. I was amazed at how many big songs they have written. The Everlys sound as good, if not better, than I remembered. Buddy Emmons was stellar as usual. In fact the whole band was exceptional IMHO. Mel |
Jason Odd Member From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia |
![]() Yep, i'm with Mike on this one as well. Buddy used to hang out with Waylon Jennings, Weldon Myrich, Sonny Curtis, bandleader Ben Hall and others around the 1954 period, you know a lot of young guns pickin' and hanging out together, he met the Wink Westerners who were touring Texas around that time (with Roy Orbison on lead vocals), and so on. Sometimes I forget how hot Texas was and laways has been, and I mean hot as in 'hot talented performers'.. from rockabilly, Western Swing, blues and hillbilly boogie just in the 1950s alone. ------------------ |
Robert Member From: Champaign, IL |
![]() Jason: You forgot the great Tommy Allsup! |
Michael Johnstone Member From: Sylmar,Ca. USA |
![]() There was one Texas gig - and a friend of mine has a picture of it somewhere - which featured the great rock piano pioneer Moon Mullican with Buddy Holly on drums! There's also a picture of Elvis performing in a small venue in Texas in the mid 50s with Buddy clearly visible in the audience.There are a few stories I heard from Gary Busey that HE heard from the guys in the Crickets and other Lubbock "homeboys" when he was researching his movie role as Buddy.Unfortunately,I can't relate them on this forum.Suffice it to say he enjoyed his share of the fringe benifits of being a rock star.Little Richard also tells a hilarious tale about how Buddy was late for his own set one night during an Alan Freed package tour - seems he was preoccupied in the dressing room beneath the stage of an old theater but was not dressed.He heard the MC announce:"Ladies and Gentlemen - Buddy Holly!" So,he whipped his pants on,and with a raving woody,grabbed his Strat,ran up the stairs and took the stage. "If you knew - Peggy Sue....." |
Mike Perlowin Member From: Los Angeles CA |
![]() I think that If Buddy Holly had not died in the plane crash, he would have drifted out of the public eye (especially after the Beatles hit) and gone into producing, and eventually would have been a big time executive in the music business. I think Richie Valens would have gone on to become very big in the Latino market, and sustained a career in that genre for many years, and the Big Bopper would have faded into obscurity very quickly as a recording artist, but would continue to work as a disc jockey and radio personality. |
Paul Graupp Member From: Macon Ga USA |
![]() I can just hear the Big Booper on XERF selling baby chicks ! OOOOOH Baby, you know what I LIKE !! That would have been a real treat. Who knows, he might even been able to play Blues Stay Away From Me on a harmonic too and gotten richer that way. |
CrowBear Schmitt Member From: Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France |
![]() Jason, Hillbilly Boogie ? i just gotta know what it is, what it is. turn me on to who plays it so i can listen. i already know some bout Swamp Boogie. Steel what ? ![]() |
Gene Jones Member From: Oklahoma City, OK USA |
![]() During that era we played a lot of material that we called "Rockabilly"....Big Boss Man, anything by Jerry Lee Lewis, etc. It may have been the same thing! www.genejones.com |
Bob Shilling Member From: Berkeley, CA, USA |
![]() I think Mike's scenario sounds like the most likely. Buddy was pretty hands on with his production, for the times. I think his last few records had lost their punch musically too, so one more reason for him to go into production. I was a freshman in college when I "heard the news", and I remember it as well as when I heard JFK got shot. I still love that sound. ------------------ |
Jason Odd Member From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia |
![]() Hillbilly Boogie is what predated Rockabilly, although I am simplifying somewhat. Some examples are 'Muleskinner Blues' circa 1948 by the Maddox Brothers & Rose, a lot of early 1950s sides by Gene O'Quin (the excellent "Texas Boogie"), Jimmy Bryant had some boogie numbers, (he cut one in 1949 without Speedy, something like "Bryant's Boogie" I think). The Delmore brothers "Blues Stay Away From Me" is from around 1948, even Hank William's with "Move It On Over" comes into the style as an early example. |
Janice Brooks Moderator From: Pleasant Gap Pa |
![]() Mike P wrote::::::: the Big Bopper would have faded into obscurity very quickly as a recording artist, but would continue to work as a disc jockey and radio personality. ------------------ |
Mike Perlowin Member From: Los Angeles CA |
![]() quote: I didn't know he wrote all those. Thanks Janice. |
Jason Odd Member From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia |
![]() The Big Bopper's real name is Jiles Perry Richardson, aka the Big Bopper and P.J. Richardson. The songwriting credits are as follows: Chantilly Lace (Richardson) He might have borrowed bits here and there, but he did write a few good un's. |
Larry Miller Member From: Gladeville,TN.USA |
![]() quote:Jason, How about Wayne Rainey "Why Don't You Haul Off and Love Me One More Time?" It was later covered by Johnny Burnette(Rockabilly) in 1960. ![]() ------------------ [This message was edited by Larry Miller on 21 August 2001 at 06:32 PM.] [This message was edited by Larry Miller on 21 August 2001 at 06:40 PM.] |
Craig Stock Member From: Westfield, NJ USA |
![]() Michael, That club that Elvis played in that Buddy was at was probably 'The Cotton Club' on the outskirts of Lubbock, I once D.J.d at 'Frat Party' while in College in the early 80's. It was a neat place and I think it is still there whether it is open or not, I'm not sure. ------------------ |
Mike Perlowin Member From: Los Angeles CA |
![]() quote:My two favorite songs when I was a kid. I gotta hear this. |
Gene Jones Member From: Oklahoma City, OK USA |
![]() I have to admit that I hadn't heard the term "swamp Rock" until someone mentioned it above, but acording to today's OKC entertainment guide, Oklahoma City's "underground" GREEN DOOR has been hosting shows since May featuring national touring acts that range from hard core punk to psychobilly "swamp rock". For example: Black Rebel Motorcycle Club; Wesley Willis; Agnostic Front; Appleseed Cast; Mates of State, and The White Stripes. But a little voice tells me that I shouldn't go down to the "Green Door" looking for a job playing my steel. www.genejones.com |
Shaan Shirazi Member From: Austin, TX, USA |
![]() You got that right Gene that is purely a punk room, maybe my little brother's band will play there someday soon, he's a 15 yr. old drummer in OKC. I remember going to that same room when it was a different club and seeing one of the first country inspired local bands in OKC back in 1990 or so. They stood out because they did a rap version of Dolly's 9 to 5 and I swear it wasn't bad! I wonder who they were... Shaan ------------------ |
Gene Jones Member From: Oklahoma City, OK USA |
![]() Shaan I hear you. Me and your little brother are not likely to cross paths prfessionally, but I do work with some of the young musicians who gig in all venues so I'll ask them to watch for him. Are you playing your steel regularly now? Haven't heard you mention it lately. By the way, I got an e-mail from Henson Cargil's son after your article about the Oklahoma City club. Thanks for the connection. www.genejones.com |
Jason Odd Member From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia |
![]() Larry, there where a lot of rockabilly artists who did country songs in more rocked up form, the Hillbilly Boogie thing is more about uptempo bluesy boogie inspired numbers by country artists, you've got the right stuff, just the latter version. I see the term 'Swamp Rock,' I think the earliest usage I can track down are some articles an Creedence Clearwater Revial in the late 1960s, although the term 'Swamp Pop' was used to describe certain pop-country-rockabilly infused Southern artists in the late 1950s, 'Sea Of Love' etc. Swamp Rock seemed to have become popular to describe a certain post-punk blend by groups who mixed wrist slashing country, punk, blues and the like in a sort of Creedence meets Captain Beefheart, Tom Waits, punk rock kind of thing. There was a swag of Australian bands that came out in this style, the Scientists, Le Hoodoo Gurus (turned into the more poppy Hoodoo Gurus), The Birthday Party (turned into the more menacing Birthday Party), the Beast Of Bourbon (they do a killer version of 'Psycho')..and others. |
CrowBear Schmitt Member From: Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France |
![]() how bout Slim Harpo,Lightnin Slim,+ Tony Joe White for Swamp kontribution ? thanx Jason 4 the posts. Steel what ? ![]() [This message was edited by CrowBear Schmitt on 30 August 2001 at 04:00 PM.] |
Skip T Member From: Lubbock , Tx. U S A |
![]() Craig , the "Cotton Club" is history these days. Here is a photo of Buddy and a pretty good "oldie R & R station. http://KDAV.com |
Janice Brooks Moderator From: Pleasant Gap Pa |
![]() A good day to revive this topic ------------------ |
Craig A Davidson Member From: Wisconsin Rapids, Wisconsin USA |
![]() i have worked the Surf Ballroom in Clear Lake Iowa and believe me, Buddy is still in there. If you stand on stage,close your eyes, and think Buddy Holly it brings a weird feeling over you. I am not the only one who felt it. So did my girlfriend and my kids. What a place it is with all it's history. I bet they had another Winter Dance Party Reunion there this weekend. Rave On Buddy! ------------------ |
Robert Member From: Champaign, IL |
![]() I see somebody revived this old thread - I opened it in August of 2001. It's fitting, I guess. I do find myself thinking about Buddy and his music every February. Always fun to haul out the J-200 and play some Buddy Holly tunes. BUDDY HOLLY LIVES! Rob Yale |
Jeremy Moyers Member From: Atlanta GA/ Nashville TN |
![]() I am from Lubbock Tx, and being a third generation steel player I have heard many stories about the music industry back in this time era from my grandfather, Wally Moyers Sr. He played with Bill Mac, Waylon Jennings as well as Buddy. He was in the house band at the famous "Cotton Club" here in Lubbock, he played on the Hootanany Hoe down (?Spelling) as well as many other live radio programs of the time. What a cool time period for music. One story he told me was that one morning Buddy came over to his house very early to see if he would be interested in playing with his band, the crickets. My grandfather told him that he would love to jam with them, but that he did not want to join his band. He told buddy "You'll never go anywhere playing that music you play with all of those open chords" He told me that back then you played bar chords not the open chords that are frequently used today. If he only knew then what Buddys career would turn into. Jeremy |
Jody Sanders Member From: Magnolia,Texas |
![]() My older brother Jerry Sanders was at KDAV in the "hayday" of the Cotton Club". Also the radio station in Littlefield. He has told me some great Holly and Jennings stories. Jody. |
Joey Ace Sysop From: Southern Ontario, Canada |
![]() ![]() "He made it easy to wear glasses. I WAS Buddy Holly." "Buddy Holly gave you confidence. He was like the boy next door." from www.buddyholly.com [This message was edited by Joey Ace on 03 February 2002 at 01:27 PM.] |
Janice Brooks Moderator From: Pleasant Gap Pa |
![]() Long after 'day the music died,' the Big Bopper's legend lives on Rock 'n' roll's 1st tragedy claimed the star from Beaumont 46 years ago today By RON FRANSCELL Beaumont Enterprise
Why? After the crash in Clear Lake on Feb. 3, 1959, rock 'n' roll changed. By 1959, the little world of rock 'n' roll had shrunk even further. Holly's career had slumped, and at 22, he needed money. Valens, a 17- And J.P. Richardson, a 28-year-old disc jockey at Beaumont's KTRM Richardson had already become a local radio legend in Beaumont. He The pudgy, shy, crew-cut, chain-smoking "Jape," as he was known to The character was so distinct from the real-life Jape, most listeners
After a stint in the Army, Jape came home to Beaumont and KTRM with "Bax, I've died," Jape said. "Honest to God, I've died, been across Jape wrote songs in his spare time at KTRM. In June 1958, he recorded Chantilly Lace exploded onto the charts. Less than a month after it By year's end, Chantilly Lace had sold more than 1 million records. That fall, Jape also told a British magazine about another idea he "It will ultimately become standard practice for every record artist "We owe J.P. Richardson, The Big Bopper, much more credit than just The singers had never met before they embarked on the Winter Dance But it was a nightmare. The tour scribbled illogical lines across the Then the bad weather turned worse. By the time they reached Clear
But the Big Bopper was sick with the flu. He asked if there was any Later, in the Surf dressing room, Valens flipped a coin with the The plane took off at 1 a.m. in sub-freezing winds, lowering It was rock 'n' roll's first great tragedy. The next morning, searchers found the debris and the frozen corpses. For all his vision about the future of pop music and songs he had yet Jay Richardson, now 45, has clearly already grappled with his grief. Except one. He once dreamed his father stood behind him at a family dinner. It was only a dream, but it doesn't matter to Jay. He considers it For five years, Jay has toured in a musical tribute to his father, Other perfomers are imitating Buddy Holly and Ritchie Valens, but Jay When he dons his leopard-skin jacket and answers a prop phone with Sometimes after the show, fans who saw his father during his six He signs autographs as "Big Bopper Jr." Jay's oldest son is the fourth J.P. Richardson, and his three That's all changed now. "We still have those 23 lyrics," Jay says. "Those are what we call Richardson was buried in Beaumont. From Germany, U.S. Army Pvt. Elvis A granite monument to his father has been erected at the Surf Jape's headstone at Forest Lawn Cemetery is simple and unremarkable. No streets are named for him. No festivals celebrate his life. No
"Some years on Feb. 3, the newspaper only has one line that Richardson's accomplishments surpass being "some other guy" who died After Hollywood's Buddy Holly Story and La Bamba lionized the other His idea for music videos was way ahead of its time. When MTV figured Today, the Bopper's songs earn up to an estimated $100,000 for his Ironically, the Bopper never made much money for himself on his For Jay, the frozen Iowa cornfield where The Big Bopper drew his last Beyond the marker, about 40 feet on the other side of a barbed-wire He walks out to the spot alone. Leaving the cornfield on a frigid late-January day much like the "There was something I didn't tell you back there at the Surf," he |
Rick McDuffie Member From: Smithfield, North Carolina, USA |
![]() Think about Carl Perkins, one of Buddy's contemporaries. He was huge in the 50's and, like Buddy, a big influence on the Beatles and 60's music. Yet, he is best remembered by many these days for being a member of Johnny Cash's backup band. Yet, he was a fine songwriter, guitarist and singer in his own rite. Buddy, like Carl, Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard and others, would've been a dinosaur in the 60's, even though he helped shape the era. No doubt, he was a great talent- but I'm sure his status was elevated by his premature death while at the top of his game. |
Ken Lang Member From: Simi Valley, Ca |
![]() Thank you Janice for that most informative post. |
johnnyb Member From: Wendell, NC, USA |
![]() * [This message was edited by johnnyb on 29 June 2005 at 02:10 PM.] |
Sonny Jenkins Member From: New Braunfels, Tx. 78130 |
![]() I grew up in Lubbock with Buddy,,,a ton of talent came out of Lubbock (and surrounding area)in that era. Had it not have been for a kid from Tupelo, Buddy would have probably been a bluegrass star (Buddy and Bob and the Bluegrass Boys). I think the "Bob" was the same Bob Montgomery that went on to Producer and Music Exec in Nashville. And let's not forget Mac Davis (the most clean cut little kid you ever saw, 2-3 years younger than me, used to follow us home from school). It was agood time to grow up in Lubbock. [This message was edited by Sonny Jenkins on 06 February 2005 at 09:07 AM.] |
Smiley Roberts Member From: Hendersonville,Tn. 37075 |
![]() quote: johnnyb, ------------------ |
Rick McDuffie Member From: Smithfield, North Carolina, USA |
![]() When Johnny had his network TV show, I remember seeing Eric Clapton, Carl Perkins and someone else (maybe it was Luther) play Blue Suede Shoes, Honey Don't, or something like that. They traded choruses, and Carl Perkins (in my opinion) smoked EC. Must've been about 1970. |
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