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  Technical Progress in Recording? (Page 2)

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Author Topic:   Technical Progress in Recording?
Bobby Lee
Sysop

From: Cloverdale, North California, USA

posted 17 May 2005 04:21 PM     profile     
quote:
If you want true stereo you just have to go to a live concert.
Really? I thought that the main mix was mono at most concerts. Really loud mono, but mono just the same.
George Kimery
Member

From: Limestone, TN, USA

posted 17 May 2005 08:57 PM     profile     
In some things, absolutely perfect is not a good thing. For instance, if you see any of the old hand painted pin stripes (which by the way is pretty much a lost art) and then look at the absolutely perfect pinstriping done with vinyl tape today, the old imperfect just looks so much better. Look at a great painting, say of Mona Lisa. To make it perfect, you would take a photo of her. Which looks better? In recording music, if the space between the notes is absolutely perfect, such as can be accomplished with a drum machine and/or electronic device, and you compare it to the imperfect sound of a live band, the live band will sound better to the ears every time. To quote Jimmy Day when hearing a player playin a gazillion notes, "I wish I could play like that.... (then pausing) but I wouldn't" Humans need to keep the art in recording more and not let science ever replace it. Using Jimmy's thinking, engineers and producers should say "I wish I could record absolutely perfect.....but I wouldn't."
Dustin Rigsby
Member

From: Columbus, Ohio

posted 18 May 2005 06:35 AM     profile     
David Donald,
You are right about all of that. I have a friend who works with pro tools all of the time. He tells of the nightmares of computers crashing and losing everything he has "pieced" together. I just like the old vinyl records. I got a bunch of 'em. I know trends change,but,I'll take Steely Dan's mix any day of the week over what is out now. Those were some sweet mixes,almost sonicly perfect. JMHO

------------------
D.S. Rigsby
Wilcox SD10 3&5
http://www.touchinglittlelives.org

John Macy
Member

From: Denver, CO USA

posted 18 May 2005 09:59 AM     profile     
You know, I grew up on analogue--my first entry into the studio world was in 1971 as an intern. State of the art for the time, an Ampex MM1000 16 track into an Electrodyne console. Worked in analogue for 30 or so years after that, heck, I still own an MM1100 16 track and an Otari 24 track.

Spent too much time with ADATs in the '90s, but clients demanded it. Also lots of brain damage keeping the 2" analogue synced up to the ADATs for more tracks. To preserve my fond memories of them, I gutted a blackface ADAT and turned it into a cactus garden--finally a good use for one of them...

I've been working "in the box" now for a few years, and I have to say I love it and would never go back. It took a while to find the platform that gave me the sonic results I was looking for, and once I found it, I am completely happy. I track a lot into ProTools, but was never happy with the way it sounded internally. Bussed out to a console, it was fine, but I wanted to work with the recall capabilites of mixing "in the box". I ended up using Paris, a now defunct product developed by Ensoniq, and used by fellow steelers Mike Smith and Tommy Detamore (I think maybe Bill Terry also). My mastering guy in Nashville swears Paris is the closest thing to analogue you can get. The imaging and depth are astounding.

Anyway, like I said earlier, it's just a tool. I do plenty of cut and paste, but only if it helps the project. I tune a lot of vocals, but always manually, not in the auto mode, and it works great. I have a great collection of mics and preamps, which really help in the digital domain. The visual thing alone is enough to make me never go back. Done correctly, you can achieve "vintage" quality with modern gear .

By the way, Dustin, most of those great Steely Dan records were cut and mixed on the 3M digital systems.... As for computers crashing, well it happens on rare occasions, and if you are in a good habit of saving, one rarely loses much info. I think your friend's system is not setup correctly.

Leslie Ehrlich
Member

From: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

posted 18 May 2005 01:11 PM     profile     
I like the era we now live in - good quality recording is so much more affordable. I sure don't miss the corporate rock/disco era where artists recorded in multimillion dollar studios with 32 track two inch reel to reel decks, $3000 condenser mics, umpteen dozen channel mixing consoles, and paid thousands upon thousands of dollars to record an album.

David L. Donald
Member

From: Koh Samui Island, Thailand

posted 18 May 2005 01:29 PM     profile     
John M. I hear you. Ah, dem's was da days!

I started out on a SCULLY 1" 8 track ( still have it somewhere in upstate NY.)
and Flickinger console...!
then a MUCH better Soundworkshop. And finally a small Trident.

Sub mixed to a Sony PCM- F1 and back to the Scully.
Was good enough to fool Todd Rundgren up at Bearsville,
3 times into thinking it was 24 track 2" work.
That was on Liv Tyler's mothers band.

I then did have a MM1000, tweaked for super hot tape no NR. and a wierd strobe on tape reel automation system.

I do like analogue, but also wouldn't go back either.
I do a lot of live tracking if I can, and use a lot of stereo micing,
because I have many more tracks to work with.

I did get un the studio in NYC with Don Fagen and yes it is digital,
and serious automated routing in both analogue and digital domains.
They were early adopters of digital because of the clarity.

Again, it is not the car, but the nut behind the wheel.

Bill Terry
Member

From: Bastrop, TX, USA

posted 18 May 2005 02:55 PM     profile     
quote:
I ended up using Paris, a now defunct product developed by Ensoniq, and used by fellow steelers Mike Smith and Tommy Detamore (I think maybe Bill Terry also). My mastering guy in Nashville swears Paris is the closest thing to analogue you can get.

Yep, I've hung around a good bit at Tommy's place and it sold me on the Ensoniq Paris system. I messed with and owned various Tascam pro and semi-pro analog multitrack recorders over the years, and I'd never go back to analog either. The Paris system seems to offer the benefits of digital recording but somehow retains the warmth and character of analog. Listen to anything from Cherry Ridge and you'll hear a Paris system in capable hands (ears?)... In fact, regarding the comment that John made about vintage quality with modern gear, take a listen to Bobby Flores' "Just for the Record" which was done in large part at Cherry Ridge on Paris. That recording has the vintage vibe in spades.

I guess several have already said this, but IMO you just gotta have the right guy twisting the knobs (virtual and/or real).

John Macy
Member

From: Denver, CO USA

posted 18 May 2005 09:22 PM     profile     
You're right, Bill--Tommy is doing a killer job down there . (By the way, welcome to Paris... )

Oh yeah, the look I see on my ProTools clients when they hear their audio files played back in Paris is pretty amazing--they can hardly believe how much bigger, broader and deeper it is (and this includes HD)

[This message was edited by John Macy on 18 May 2005 at 09:23 PM.]

[This message was edited by John Macy on 18 May 2005 at 09:25 PM.]


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