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Author | Topic: Faith Hill - Tim McGraw...country? |
Kirk Hamre Member From: Birmingham, Alabama |
![]() I just listened to "Like we never loved at all" single...this is country?...sounds like pure Pop to me. "Mississippi Girl"...does anyone remember Bob McDill, he wrote a song in 1980 called "Song of the South", Alabama recorded it. "Mississippi Girl sounds like a "Song of the South" rip-off to me...anyone agree? Oh and lastly, Janis Joplin would be devastated to hear Faith's pop-ditty verson of "Piece of my heart"...what happened to Nashville...country capital of the world? All I hear is pop-garbage out of that place. Where are the up and coming George Jones, Merle Haggard, Gene Watson, Waylon Jennings, Mel Street, Charley Pride, David Allan Coe, John Anderson, Moe Bandy, etc. musicians of today??? Oh, and another thing Nashville, dump all those stupid videos you produce, you waste time, intellect, and money. What happened to real musicians, playing real music, with real instruments??? The video has become the primary art while the music is just some secondary exercise that is added later to round-out the video. I just had to get this off my chest...the whole thing really infuriates me. Young listeners today are really getting riped-off. I try and introduce real music to young people as much as I can...they're certainly not going to hear it on radio or any of these fraudulent country TV channles. |
Tony Prior Member From: Charlotte NC |
![]() I would say that it is a serious attempt to be labled as a COUNTRY STAR by playing POP songs. No different than Wynonna playing the Opry this past weekend.. Her Opry appearance was not even a good POP set.. Her set did not, in my view, even come close to blending with the rest of the show.... Me, I personally think she is talented, a fine singer..but has totally lost her way.. But I also think she believes she is more popular than she actually is... Faith and Tim... they can pretty much do whatever they want..
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David Doggett Member From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() Kirk, I'm glad you got that off your chest, and you have lots of company here on the Forum. But you're stuck in time. In the '30s, country music was Jimmy Rogers, the Carter Family, and Uncle Dave Macon. In the '60s it was George and Tammy - completely different sounds. Country music is not just the music you remember from your youth. For everybody else, including historians, the press and the market place, country music is what is made in Nashville, bought by country music fans, covered in country music magazines, and played on country music stations. Today it is Tim and Faith. Yeah, it's pretty much modern pop-rock, sung with southern accents (more or less). But they don't play it on the rock and hip-hop stations, because everyone but old country fans like you and me instantly recognize it as country. If I have the local pop-country station playing when my teenage girls get in the car, they recognize a Nashville product in three notes and change the station to rock or hip-hop. It doesn't matter to them if it is Tim and Faith, Kenny Chesney, Grandpa Jones, or George Jones - it's all country to them. You don't have to like it, but you can't say everything pre-'70s is country, and everything after that is not. There are many eras in country music. But to everybody else country music is always what is made in Nashville and played on country stations. I understand what you are saying, and I respect your preferences (and mostly agree with them probably). But all you are really saying is that you like the older styles of country music, and don't like the latest style. It is great to try to show young people what they are missing in the old stuff. But if your attitude is that the stuff from your youth was the greatest, and their stuff today is "garbage," you are being patronizing to them, and they will recognize it and be turned off. As for Janis Joplin, she was a southern rocker. I think she would have loved Faith's rocking country version of Piece of My Heart with Paul Franklin tearing it up on pedal steel. It's damn good music (the best thing Faith ever did). So was Janis' original version. |
Bob Smith Member From: Allentown, New Jersey, USA |
![]() Im sure everybody here knows by my posts on this forum, that I enjoy alot of the current country radio stuff. I think its full of great guitar and steel playing.(i never listen much to song lyrics) I doubt, if anybody here, wants to start insulting the guys that play their instruments on most of these tunes.How about the new Joe Nichols song, " Tequila Makes Her Clothes Fall Off", does that qualify as a "real' country tune?I t sounds like one to me. I wonder too ,where Wy Judd fits in . think she might appeal to the christian end of the scene? |
Theresa Galbraith Member From: Goodlettsville,Tn. USA |
![]() "Piece Of MY Heart" sounds country to my ears. I prefer Faith's singing over Janis Joplin's any day. Kirk, I agree Faith's new cd is more pop than country. Atleast, she uses steel! [This message was edited by Theresa Galbraith on 02 November 2005 at 09:21 AM.] |
Kirk Hamre Member From: Birmingham, Alabama |
![]() Yes, Paul Franklin's steel work is first class. Unfortunately, if the steel guitar was removed from these songs, there would be very little recognizable country flavor...all you would have left is pop. I recognize there is a huge market for pop music in this country and the average listener is not very discriminating. I guess I'm a tough sell. I just wish they would call it pop and not country. |
Chris Forbes Member From: Beltsville, MD, USA |
![]() Wynonna Judd fitting in on the Christian end? What about her DWI? I think that wouldn't endear her too much to the Christian crowd (of course, the way she sang before that world series game wouldn't endear her to any fan of good singing, ugh!). |
Theresa Galbraith Member From: Goodlettsville,Tn. USA |
![]() You guys are tough. |
Charles Davidson Member From: Alabama, USA |
![]() As my favorite Dale Watson song states[Country My Ass]He nailed it,no doubt about it!!!! |
Craig A Davidson Member From: Wisconsin Rapids, Wisconsin USA |
![]() Hey Chris, God forgives you know. That's how it is with Wynonna. One DWI won't send you to Hell. |
Erv Niehaus Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA |
![]() My God is even big enough to forgive Jimmy Swaggart. ![]() Erv |
Chris Forbes Member From: Beltsville, MD, USA |
![]() Craig, I know that God forgives, but what about the hypocrites that walk the earth with us? Will they be as quick to forgive? (and Lord knows I'm not trying to say I'm perfect, I'm faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar from it!!) [This message was edited by Chris Forbes on 03 November 2005 at 10:56 AM.] |
Keith Cordell Member From: Atlanta |
![]() Yikes, Theresa... Faith Hill over Janis? I gotta stay out of the music section. |
Kirk Hamre Member From: Birmingham, Alabama |
![]() Yikes is right...the Faith Hill version of "Piece of my heart" has all the soul surgically removed. Probably not her fault, just another arrangement the record company manufactured for her. I heard in an interview that Faith had never heard Janis sing the song prior to Faith recording it. |
Theresa Galbraith Member From: Goodlettsville,Tn. USA |
![]() Yes, Faith over Janis any day! ![]() |
David Doggett Member From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() Well I don't think we have to try to rank Janis and Faith and their respective backup musicians. They did completely different versions of the song. Janis had soul, but voice? And Big Brother and the Holding Company today would be considered a decent garage jam band, but not that special. The Piece of My Heart album was a classic for its guts and originality, not its outstanding musicianship. But Faith and her version is all pro. Like Dolly, you can get distracted by her looks if you want to, but she has pipes. Yes, I've also read the story that she had never heard the original. All the more credit to her performance. And the pickers on her s**t kickin' version of Piece of My Heart are the kind of seasoned pros that John Sebastian took his hat off to in Nashville Cats. Yes their version is way slicker than Janis and Big Brother, but that also makes it thrilling in a different way. I wish Faith would do more of that kind of stuff, and less of the overly dramatic ballads. |
Kevin Hatton Member From: Amherst, N.Y. |
![]() Faith Hill couldn't carry Janis's Southern Comfort bottle. Not even in the same class artisticly. Janis would eat her for lunch. |
Theresa Galbraith Member From: Goodlettsville,Tn. USA |
![]() David, I too wish Faith would do more of that kind of stuff. ![]() [This message was edited by Theresa Galbraith on 03 November 2005 at 04:04 PM.] |
Mike Winter Member From: Oregon City, Oregon, USA |
![]() Faith's better lookin' though. ![]() |
Mark Eaton Member From: Windsor, Sonoma County, CA |
![]() Mike-whether you realize it or not-you are the master of understatement. ------------------ |
David Doggett Member From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() How 'bout Janis and Faith doing a duet? Mutt and Jeff. And how 'bout Paul Franklin sitting in with Big Brother and the Holding Company. Someday in Heaven. ![]() |
Charlie McDonald Member From: Lubbock, Texas, USA |
![]() No kidding, Theresa. Tough crowd. Glad I don't play country; couldn't stand the bloodshed. |
Ron Sodos Member From: Albuquerque, New Mexico, USA |
![]() Lets face it the whole country music industry has gone down the tubes. Personally I would like to take Tim McGraws leather hat and shove it up Faith Hills.........@#%&* |
Lee Baucum Member From: McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) - The Final Frontier |
![]() Sorry for the off-topic interruption, but up at the top of this topic, Bob McDill's name was mentioned. He's written bunches and bunches of hit songs. |
Bob Carlucci Member From: Candor, New York, USA |
![]() Quote :Personally I would like to take Tim McGraws leather hat and shove it up Faith Hills.........@#%&* Wow.. is that legal in Nashville?... |
David Doggett Member From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() Just for some perspective, here's yesterday's music news from Musician's Friend:
quote: The idea that "real country music" only consists of ballads and shuffles, with no rockin', is beyond quaint. [This message was edited by David Doggett on 05 November 2005 at 04:16 PM.] |
Dale Bessant Member From: Gatineau, Quebec, Canada |
![]() Well I'm happy they are making a great living from music (Iwish I was) but being a traditionalist I dont have any of their music in the house..... ![]() |
Bob Smith Member From: Allentown, New Jersey, USA |
![]() Why doesnt this topic get closed . Pretty sorry, sick and disgusting to say the least. I hope no ones daughter has to read this rotten garbage. |
Joe Casey Member From: Weeki Wachee .Springs FL (population.9) |
![]() Is anything today the same as it was 20 or 10 years ago? Even during our turn in the so called barrel we had to keep up with the times then and all the changes to stay popular and working.What works today would not have worked during our era. And what worked for us will not float the boat now. There are still great country music fans to support what was. But not enough to over power what is. Enjoy and support whatever comes along now that pleases you,and allow the fact someone enjoys buying also what pleases them. Recently Martina released a Country CD that is as the name states "Timeless".Marketing is watching the sales... If one wants to make a statement heres one that can be made by opening the wallet. Country music at one time had the 30 year old and up crowd. Now the target is the buying age which is teens and up. Kids at one time would smirk at the word "Country". Now they are into it and remember they will get old too and change as all must. ------------------ |
Dave Mudgett Member From: Central Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() We've been around and around this topic before. I'm not a big fan, to say the least, and it's not what I call country music. But I'd rather not take generic pot shots. Apropos "Piece of my Heart", my issue with Faith's version is that the feel and vocal delivery just don't match the lyrics. When I hear someone say "take another little piece of my heart, now baby", I don't expect them to sound happy and upbeat about it, and the vocal delivery here screams "lightweight", to me. The band can have all the chops in the world, and it won't fix that. Janis' vocal delivery and Big Brother's screaming-guitar approach fits much better, to me. The fact that Big Brother was not, technically, a great band is beside the point. That was well recognized back then, and is the reason they got ditched. Personally, I always felt that was one of Janis' downfalls, and numerous bios have argued this line - that she personally needed the cameraderie and musical/emotional support of a band like this, rather than a band of hired guns. I was at her last public show at Harvard Stadium - the band was great and so was she - but it did sound more like a singer with hired guns - and I missed the older style. Another in a long line of demonstrations that, to me, music is not primarily about chops, but emotion. |
Kevin Hatton Member From: Amherst, N.Y. |
![]() Wow Dave,Right on! You hit it right on the head. When Janis was singing you felt the pain through the emotion. I whole heartidly agree with you about the Big brother band. I think that their rawness was exactly what Janis needed behind her. They reeked with emotion and feel behind Janis. After they were ditched she sounded "New York". Watch Janis sing "Cry baby" in the movie "Festival Express". Faith Hill would never have a clue. Janis LIVED it though alcohol, heroin, pain, and camraderie, and when she let loose on stage you could feel it in your heart. It was like a panther being let out of its cage. Thats a legend. [This message was edited by Kevin Hatton on 06 November 2005 at 07:13 PM.] |
Dave Mudgett Member From: Central Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() quote: Kevin, you're right about that. I saw her pre- and post- Big Brother. Either way, she was a sight to behold. Channeling Bessie Smith, Big Mama Thornton, and Koko Taylor. I was right up close both times - she blew my head off. I was pretty surprised a modern-country-style singer would try to do a major-league cover of "Piece of My Heart". I suppose if it had been a real "heart" singer, it might have worked. I think it could be done effectively by someone with a major quaver to their voice - perhaps Patty Loveless or somebody like that - as a slow country burner. Just my opinion. But hey, Faith and her producers went to the bank with that tune - who am I to argue? |
Bob Carlucci Member From: Candor, New York, USA |
![]() I like Faiths version better ONLY... ONLY because of of Pauls great steel work... other wise it was a lightweight and If Faith LOOKED like Janice, it never would have even been played.... bob |
David Doggett Member From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() Well, I heard Janis sing live back in the day. My point was not to compare Faith in any way to that. She did a completely different version. She never even heard the original. My point was simply that Faith did a damn good version - one of the best things she ever did, and Paul Franklin's steel work was a big part of it. When I first heard it on the radio, I thought, "What a great new version of that great old song." I loved it. It never occurred to me to belittle Faith and Paul by comparing them to Janis and Big Brother. And it never occurred to me that this was in any way worse than rockin' country songs in the past, or that it was in any way unworthy of being called country music. Sorry I can't work up more negativity, but hey, life is short. You take your pleasures where you may. ![]() |
Charles French Member From: Ms. |
![]() quote: I rest my case! (previously stated tastelessly)
quote: Kirk, many feel if a recording has a top notch steel player or any revered player that all is well. I completely agree with you that Mr. Franklin is first class. He's as good as it gets! I could probably get any top session player in the world to play on my recording if I dusted dem good enough. Sure nuff the band would sound great altho the same could not apply to me.
quote: Dave, I was trying to convey these sentiments above. You just said it a lot better!!!
quote: See, I told ya so!
quote: Leave Paul out of this. You won't find a remark that belittles Paul on this planet. If you find one, just point me in their direction. And when my brother gets off work, he'll get what's he's got coming. SIDEBAR--> Ya'll ever noticed that every dance band in the world does a lame A$$ version of "I Feel Good" Funny, you never hear any of them attempt "Cold Sweat" Altho I would love to hear Faith's version!
quote: Now that's Great! P.S. I've never even heard Faith's version of this song. But then I wouldn't have had to hear Pat Boone doing "Tutti-Frutti" either! Let's see, hmmmm Pat Boone or Little Richard? Don't make me choose. [This message was edited by Charles French on 07 November 2005 at 06:38 AM.] [This message was edited by Charles French on 08 November 2005 at 04:40 AM.] |
Dave Mudgett Member From: Central Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() When someone does a cover of a tune that is so well known and revered in another style of music, comparisons are just inevitable. It is not belittling anybody to make the obvious comparison in vocal delivery. The subject came up as a very positive comparison. Of course, one opinion deserves another. ![]() In general, I didn't saying anything against Faith, and certainly not against the pickers on her recordings - they are some of the world's finest. I agree that the steel playing on "Piece of My Heart" is killer. Faith has a good voice, but I had issues with her vocal delivery on this particular tune and explained why. That was my immediate gut reaction the very first time I heard the tune. For steel lovers, a great steel ride can sometimes save a tune with other issues, but I just couldn't get past the vocal delivery here. I do agree that generic "Faith and Tim" bashing is pointless. There has always been good and bad music in any style. If we always insist to ourselves that a pointed negative comment be accompanied by a straightforward explanation of why, I think this kind of discussion would be elevated. Edited to add:
quote: Yup. [This message was edited by Dave Mudgett on 07 November 2005 at 07:16 AM.] |
David Doggett Member From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA |
![]() Charles F., here's the thread that started this Faith Hill/modern country bashing. http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum15/HTML/010614.html There's a link there where you can hear her and Paul F. doing "Piece of My Heart" as a country rocker (warning: beautiful woman singing and dancing in stupid video, and rocking modern country music - may not be appropriate for older viewers ![]() [This message was edited by David Doggett on 07 November 2005 at 08:43 AM.] |
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