----I'd want to read Dave Van Allen's current opinions on this. He has used both of these speakers with his Twin and knows the personality of JBLs far better than I do.

[This message was edited by Jon Light on 30 July 2004 at 12:59 PM.]

Is your Webber a ceramic or alnico magnet?

quote:

---

----I'd want to read Dave Van Allen's current opinions on this.
He has used both of these speakers with his Twin and knows the
personality of JBLs far better than I do.

---

I think Jon is giving me too much credit. I am not technically astute
about amps/speakers as others on the forum; I know just enough
electronics to be a danger to myself. But I do know what I like.

so- more than you prolly want to know follows...

Background:

I have always been partial to Fender Tube Amplification. For 25 years I
played thru a '72 Vibrolux Reverb as my primary combo amp, and naturally
longed for more power for volume pedal headroom. I also have 2 mid 60's
Bassman Amps with closed-back 2 x 12' cabinets so if I NEEDED to get
louder I would use either both of them or the VR and a Bassman. But
that's a lot to load and carry and I lusted after a Twin Reverb.

When I finally got my '68 Fender Twin Reverb Amp, it had already been
modified (I'm assuming early in it's life) to hold a 15" JBL D130F in a
steel guitar "tone quest"

I was told and have no reason to doubt that it had been basically a
house amp at a honkytonk for the previous 25 years or so, and boy did it
smell like it! It reeked of cigarette smoke so badly that my wife
requested I leave it out on the back porch to air out for two weeks
after it arrived UPS. It still has that unmistakeable odor when it gets
warmed up (but I like it- reminds me of my misspent youth).

The JBL that was in it is an 8 ohm speaker being driven by a 4 ohm
output. Because of that I believe that it was not producing nearly the
volume one might expect from a Twin, but it was "loud enough." And
sounded unbelievably great, rich and smooth except for...

I experienced some farting noises when playing low glisses that I
believed were the speaker complaining, so in fear of destroying it I
looked for a suitable replacement. I decided on the Weber Cali 15" after
reading what I could on the Fender Discussion Forum::Vintage Amp group,
and an email discussion with Weber about what they might recommend for
steel guitar in that amp. I purchased the ceramic magnet with the aluminum dome
cover, 4 ohm to match the amp output.

Upon installing it I definitely had an increase in loudness I attribute
to the 4 ohm match. But I also still experienced farting noise on low
glisses. With the Weber it was more like digital clipping, very brittle
square wave type sound.

So the amp finally went to the shop where it got a complete health check
and refurb, with replacing capacitors, adding 3 prong plug and all the
stuff it needed after 30 some years to make it a workinman's amp again.

FInally, having a stable test platform I could reliably compare the
speakers.

I put the JBL back in. The response was still way smooth, with 30 years
of "mojo". The low end was fat but not sharply distinct,the highs clear
yet not brittle and the mids were very mellow. the volume was again
attenuated. This is not generally a problem with the folks I play with.

I LOVE the sound of the JBL but after about 5 months I put the Weber
back in to give it a fair trial.

Again I experienced the volume increase I associate with the correct ohm
match. I've played many gigs over the last 10 or so months with the
Weber, in order to "break it in", and whether it's the speaker or my
ears getting broken in, I am VERY fond of the Cali. the response accross
the spectrum is even, with a pronounced clarity in the bass that has
taken getting used to - the JBL sounds more "compressed". The Cali is
just CLEAN. It has become sparkly, not brittle as my first impression on
the top end after several gig-hours of playing. I agree with Jon's
statement about the response

quote:

---

'flat' I don't mean, like, blah......I just mean
'neutral'--it produces the signal from the amp without lending much
additional color.

---

It's NOT a "replica" replacement a D130F, but it is a fine modern
interpretation of a loud clean 15" for a vintage amp. They are not
power rated for SolidState levels of power, but for my Twin (early
enough that it's 80 -100w and not the 135w of later master volume Twins)
it's a speaker I'm confident I won't blow out (unlike my trepidation
about abusing my 30+ yr old "mojo" laden JBL) that gives me the clarity
I need for steel.

I Have put the JBL into a formerly empty 2x12 Bassman cabinet I had
layin' about. Mounted it centered on a 3/4 plywood baffle, and am using
it with the Vibrolux. Not enough power to hurt it, but that Fender Tube
Amp sound thru a classic speaker. Great for quiet gigs or around the
house (I am thinking of cutting a port in the bafle though...)

like I said, prolly more than you want to know.

------------------

"I've got the "ZB Jeebies™" !"

1998 Zumsteel U12 "Loafer" 8&6 :: 1973 ZB Custom D-10 8&5 :: Vintage Fender 'Tube' Amplification

www.dvanet.net :: zbcustom73@dvanet.net :: www.lasttrainhome.com
:: My Tribute to the Hot Club of America in Hi-Fi

[This message was edited by Dave Van Allen on 10 August 2004 at 10:24 AM.]