I don't know that many down here that are making $300.00 a day. The union scale is about $140.00 now and most artists are paying between that and $200.00 a day. It's just the established artists that pay that kind of money and most not even that.
So I hate to hurt your average but I would think it's closer to $175.00 a show.
But when you consider there are more artists scratching their way to the top than there are on top already you can figure they can't afford to pay more after travel expenses and booking fees. Alot of these NEW acts don't even break even because they can't command a higher price.
I quit working the road for the simple reason I don't want to do it anymore and I make more money in town doing sessions,teaching,playing clubs and such. And I'm not cooped up on a bus with 6 to 8 personalities that I have to adjust to everytime the wind blows.
If you get into music for the money you'll be heartbroken most of the time you're in it.
Take it as it comes and store what you can away.
But back to the topic it's true that alot of artists don't pay what they could but they know that they can replace you in a New York minute and they know the local won't do a thing to them about it.
So you either take it or leave it. Do the road work, see as much of the world as you can and when it starts getting to you, Get Out and let somebody else take the abuse.

Mike Sweeney

[This message was edited by Mike Sweeney on 28 April 2003 at 02:38 PM.]

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[This message was edited by Damir Besic on 28 April 2003 at 04:07 PM.]

Just my 2 cents from what I have seen.

Jeremy Moyers

Oh yeah, if the band takes a month or two off, the bus lease keeps going. Most of the time it is not pay as you go with transportation.

Amd I agree completely with Mike Sweeney's Posts. He is right on.

[This message was edited by Jeremy Moyers on 28 April 2003 at 05:30 PM.]

I would have never thought road life was like that. What a fascinating thread!

Thanks for the stories.

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Bill Sampler
Carter S-10/DB 4x5
Nashville 1000
POD Pro

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DavidWright.us
Sierra Guitars

Sierra S-12 9&7
Peavey-2000-PX-300

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

Joe's in-laws had some stout financial assets and put a 7 piece band on the road
at this time. I was one member, playing steel.

Joe was a songwriter, and a pretty good one.
Even did one called "Dobro Man", before I hooked up with him, and Dobro Man was released as a 45, with none other than Buddy
Emmons playing the dobro on the 45.

Anyway, we cut an album in Seattle of mostly original compostions. The final mix was done in Nashville, and 10,000 copies were pressed.

His father-in-law (Mr Bucks) had the entire crew, including Bobby [Bus driver/sound man]
go into Seattle and dump I don't have a clue, but a lot, of money just on "oufits"
[2 entire outfits w/vests] for all of us.

Our bus that we toured in was an old, early
fixed-up jobber, with a rounded-over rear topside - kind of like early street busses, and was once owned by the Seekers.

Air conditioning units that didn't always work, especially when we needed them, like on our SW swing thru Gallup, NM, and a week
gig [7 nights] at the El Rancho...a simply beautiful old hotel with round hallways...
and was built by Hollywood to house John Wayne and all the other cowfolks of that era for Hollywood westerns.

We each were paid $250, tax free, per week.

Hey...I was a real pedal steel faker at the time, sort-of-speak, but Joe and everyone else liked my playing enough to take me on, what I have to say, is a ride everyone should experience.

I've always been single, still am, and I could get by, back then, on $250/wk.

But the OTHER things are what I'm trying to convey. Being paid to see this great land, meet great people, meet horny women, and, actually, putting yourself to the test. And the test is the ROAD. All that you have ever heard about the road, no matter if you've ever doubted any artist's SPIEL, what they say about THE ROAD is not fiction.

Yes...it starts out small and naive. But,
down the ROAD (and the mileage has a wide swing)...it gets old pretty quick.

If you have any sense of eating healthy, well, truckstops (and don't get me wrong here....you can not get a better breakfast anywhere in this country, or any other country).....

When you're on the ROAD, truckstops seem to be the only unalternative place to eat.

You are on a bus..you go where the bus goes.. so if the bus is not gonna stop at Farmer Brown's organic veggie and fruttie
farm stand, than you have to stick with
ROAD food, for the most part.

Hey.....I love bisquits & gravy. I love
bacon and eggs. I love oatmeal and maple
sausages. I love Omlets. I love eggs benedict. I love red, green, halapeno peppers in any of the above.

I love breakfast.

Back to the topic...I'm 56 now, and even if I was a desired player [play guitar and sing too] to join up and go on the road.....I doubt it.

But I did not say NO. If you can get the pay
you need to GET BY, PAY THE BILLS....

Hey....the gals are still out there, and, believe it or not, they just love that new face that pulls into town.

That's what I loved about being on the ROAD.
just the nice ways you were treated...
even if you didn't go over so well...

Every musician should GO OUT ON THE ROAD....

THERE IS NO REAL MONEY IN IT. BUT THERE IS
EXCITEMENT, MIND-BOGGLING ADULATION [REAL,OR ILL-PERCIEVED]. A REAL EDUCATION [I FINALLY GOT AN EDUCATION, IN SPITE OF MY SCHOOLING].

AND BEING PAYED AND TRANSPORTED TO SEE, AND PLAY YOUR DURN GUITAR, IN PLACES THAT YOU WOULD PROBABLY NEVER CHOOSE TO VISIT, LEFT TO YOUR OWN DEVISES, AND YOUR PLAYING ABILITY.

I know this. I have lived it. Not so bad.

[This message was edited by CHIP FOSSA on 28 April 2003 at 08:02 PM.]

Hasn't left me.

We are one and indivisable.

Give me your best shot......

The reality can be a little harsh, it's true - 'bus life' isn't for everyone - I eagerly anticipate my next trip fo weeks, and after a few days, I'm ready to go home! The food can be awful (after years of travelling around the USA, I'm amused when I'm told how dreadful British food is!!!), and it takes me days to get re-adjusted after being away.

Despite all these hardships, I'm well aware that there are plenty of guys ready to take your place if you falter - musicians are the ultimate in disposable commodities.

I've seen the world, though - Australia, Europe, the Middle and Far East, and now the USA - and it's my ambition to go to my grave owing lots of money to the credit card companies.

In that last regard, I think I probably picked the right career....

quote:

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after years of travelling around the USA, I'm amused when I'm told how dreadful British food is!!!

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As far as the road in general goes, I also agree that everyone who wants to needs to try it. It is a great experience. The only advice I would give is to not get too tied to one artist. I stayed with Lonestar almost 4 years, and thats about a year and a half too long. It is real easy to get a bad taste in your mouth for the road because you get burned out on one gig. Not all gigs are the same, and sometimes you get a good one, sometimes not. And there is only so long you can play the same 15 songs without going crazy!

One more thing, I would warn everyone not to listen to those who have not been successful in getting a good paying road gig. Yes there are plenty of people in Nashville out of work, but there are also plenty of people who have been very successful in Nashville. I cna list several players who make $70,000 a year or more from just their artist gig. Those are the guys to look at and listen to. The gigs are out there, you just have to know the right people, be in the right place at the right time, be a good guy to live with, because after all you are only on stage one hour a day, you are opn a bus the rest of the time, and of course be able to play when you get your shot.

Jeremy

[This message was edited by Jeremy Moyers on 29 April 2003 at 06:26 AM.]

The per diem thing is so great: Hey! Here's $25! Have fun. I lived so cheaply on the road it was ridiculous, spending like $5 a day. I made $600 a week, plus PDs and a cut of the merch sales. That is not $300 a show, but I don't make $300 a day here in corporate hell! One thing I feel I should add, as I sit here wearing a tie, is that even the worst day on the road (and how bad can that really be?) sure beats commuting to an office job and doing something you don't care about for eight-nine hours... just so you can play your steel guitar in the east village for $50. I'd go on tour in two seconds if one came up! Problem is NOBODY in NY other than Norah Jones and Strokes have any dough for sidemen...what a business this is. Thanks for your great posts that offered a glimpse of the real world.

[This message was edited by Gerald Menke on 29 April 2003 at 11:40 AM.]

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They did lease the busses because of many reasons. First off, to buy one fully decked out is close to 3/4 of a million dollars (according to the sources at hemphill I spoke with and a few of the drivers we had.). To lease is just $120,000 a year, and that includes tires and all the maintenance. Maintenance and tires aloan could sent you to the poor house if you owned one. That also includes storage, cleaning services, and the list goes on and on. The other advantage is that you can get a new bus every year if you want. It is also a big gamble to buy because the way artists are coming and going, hot one day and gone the next, That is an huge investment to make. What if they were to lose there deal tomorrow? How would they make that bus payment?

As far as the day job thing goes, I am with you. I quit the road because of the burn out discussed above. But now after 2 years of a day job and playing weekends I can not wait to go back out. I have a few artist gigs I'll probably go out on closer to the fall and I really excited about going out again.

Jeremy Moyers

[This message was edited by Jeremy Moyers on 29 April 2003 at 08:18 AM.]

In my first-US tour innocence a few years back, I suggested starting a small collection for our 'bus driver (as we would in Britain) as we neared the end. I was soon assured that he made much more than we did. He was a steel-player himself, who'd taken up driving - that should have told me everything right there.....

The thing about aging, at least for me, is the realization that time is the most precious thing I have. I need to be in control of my time to create products and future work, to repair things that break, to maintain and upgrade my home, etc, etc,. Things that younger players haven't the interest in, or accumulated the stuff of life that has to be repaired, maintained, etc.

So, that 90 minutes onstage is fun, but the time on the bus is time that I start feeling taken away from things I need to get done back home. But that's just me. I've done the road things.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

Thanks for the view from quite a bit higher up the ladder! Wow, $750,000 for a bus, that must be Faith Hill/Tim McGraw style no? Plasma TVs, sattelite TV, queen beds etc. You'd fall off your chair laughing if you knew what we paid for our van...but when you do the numbers as you did it makes sense, I was just involved in a much smaller-time outfit.

Did you work for them prior to their becoming mega-crossover stars (I still hear their songs in NYC!)and watch them go big time or come in later? It would be interesting to know if their sidemen, i.e. you, did much better as their situation changed, when they made the jump from an Econoline to a Silver Eagle, etc. Good to hear you are going back out again. Go get 'em.

I was with them from 1997 to 2001, so I was with them through all the second album and third album, which included amazed and all the cross over hits. Things did change after Amazed hit, but not as dramatically as one may think. As far as us side guys, there were three of us and they took care of us. We went from about $225 a show to a nice salary, which made it much easier to budget knowing what income you had coming in from week to week. However, it was let known that there were others out there who would take your jobin a heartbeat if we did not toe the line, so it became too much like a job. And for me if music isn't fun, I'm not doing it!

Hey Theresa, good to here from you. Tell hello to everyone for me.

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Steel what?

On the serious side, back in the mid '60s, our "star" promised us $75 per show, and guaranteed 3 shows per week. Didn't always work out that way, but I must have done alright. He did supply uniforms most of the time, but drycleaning and dinner was out of our money. Normally, it was sleep in the bus, or sometimes in the home of a fan/groupie. As I recall, we didn't have to buy many drinks, though.

There have been a few (very few, actually) stars who paid their bands well. One, that I know of, paid musicians a SALARY of around $50,000 per year, but that star was working 240-250 dates a year. That's a tiring living...Prevost or not!