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  Best double neck Sho Bud to buy???

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Author Topic:   Best double neck Sho Bud to buy???
Kirk Hamre
Member

From: Birmingham, Alabama

posted 16 August 2005 12:53 PM     profile     
I'm considering selling my Emmons SD10 and buying a Sho bud double neck. I like the Sho Bud tone and I like the LKL bracket that is mounted at an angle to better follow the natural swing of my left leg. What is the best Sho Bud Double neck model to buy? I'm not looking for any special set-ups, just the Emmons 8 & 4.
Thanks,
Kirk
Farris Currie
Member

From: Ona, Florida, USA

posted 16 August 2005 01:58 PM     profile     
KIRK,i'll catch heck for this,but the professional is the best!!!!i just bought one from Duane Dunard, which came from Tommy White right off the Grand Old Oprey, the best sound i ever heard. You can't beat the SHO-BUD professionals farris
Ken Byng
Member

From: Southampton, England

posted 16 August 2005 02:12 PM     profile     
Tone-wise the Pro 111 Custom, alloy necks with George L pickups is a wonderful sounding guitar.
James Morehead
Member

From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA

posted 16 August 2005 02:37 PM     profile     
I'm with Farris. I have two Professionals, couldn't be happier. You would do well to converse with Ricky Davis before you leap.
David Doggett
Member

From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA

posted 16 August 2005 02:55 PM     profile     
Ricky Davis has said the early-'70s Pro II with the 2-hole bell cranks has the best tone of all. Bobbe Seymour has said the mid-'70s Pro IIs and IIIs with the 3/2 changer and multi-hole bell cranks were the best in terms of modern mechanics. Probably any of them from the '70s can be made good with some refurbishing with John Coop's new precision parts. Also, any old Sho-Bud can be rebuilt by Duane Marrs with precision modern mechanics. The ones from the '60s seem to be hit or miss, depending on how good they were to start with and how well they have been treated. In general, Sho-Buds seem to be appreciated for their looks, tone and nostalgia value, not their mechanics.
Ernest Cawby
Member

From: Lake City, Florida, USA

posted 16 August 2005 03:09 PM     profile     
I have played a 1973 D10 The Professional for more than 30 years and never needed repairs at all, just cleaned and oiled. I play it bare footed, stays in tune, plays well and the sound is so great when I bought another guitar my wife and daughter got mad and I had to trade it off.
I have just bought another shobud a single 10 and it is in the shop to make it like new. I must be sold on Shobuds.

ernie

Farris Currie
Member

From: Ona, Florida, USA

posted 16 August 2005 03:59 PM     profile     
Ken,i'm sorry,but just got rid on a pro 3,and man that got it,has done traded it tooo. pro3s with alum necks dont get it. Get you a professional and you got it. mine have the origional pick ups,dual coils,and it just came off the grand old Oprey,Tommy White playing it, and thats good enough for me. farris
JOHN COOP
Member

From: YORKTOWN, IND. USA

posted 16 August 2005 05:06 PM     profile     
Kirk..I have an early Pro II I am going to sell soon. It will have a completely new undercarriage on it with origional pickups. This will be the mid 70's 2 hole puller system. It has "TONE TO THE BONE"! Coop
Sonny Priddy
Member

From: Elizabethtown, Kentucky, USA

posted 16 August 2005 05:11 PM     profile     
Late Model SUPER PRO. BLACK. SONNY.

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Farris Currie
Member

From: Ona, Florida, USA

posted 16 August 2005 05:14 PM     profile     
John,this ain't fair, you make me just melt at the mention of those sho-buds.Dang,with all those COOP parts, just about more than a man can stand!!!!Man wish i had more money i'd buy that one tooooooo. farris
Herb Steiner
Member

From: Cedar Valley, Travis County TX

posted 16 August 2005 05:27 PM     profile     

This Professional is an early one, we think a 1970, based on the pickups and tuners. Duane Marrs says it probably was a custom guitar since the neck selector and coil tap switches are between the necks, rather than on the endplate. It now has a Marrs/Surratt undercarriage and changer and plays like a dream, still with the characteristic S~B sound.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association


[This message was edited by Herb Steiner on 16 August 2005 at 05:36 PM.]

James Morehead
Member

From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA

posted 16 August 2005 06:07 PM     profile     
Just look at all these old Buds showing up! We got enough shobudders to start a club! How about a "Shobud" Calender?
Skip Edwards
Member

From: LA,CA

posted 16 August 2005 06:10 PM     profile     
I'll chime in here & say that I've got a SuperPro that really screams.
BTW, there's a nice red, first generation ProII on eBay right now.
Farris Currie
Member

From: Ona, Florida, USA

posted 16 August 2005 06:21 PM     profile     
HERB, that red is nice,but i got a black one just like it,same inlays and all,will blow the doors off that red one!!! SORRY.

farris

Larry Robbins
Member

From: Fort Edward, New York, USA

posted 16 August 2005 06:21 PM     profile     
Ive got a 73 PRO II, brass barrels behind two hole pullers, single raise/single lower
and coil taps at 11.5 and 17.5k.
Gotta Love Them Buds!

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73 PRO II, 79/80 PRO III
Steelkings,Fender guitars,Preston covers,
and Taylor(Tut that is)
Reso's
"Of all the things Ive lost in life, I miss my mind the most"

Farris Currie
Member

From: Ona, Florida, USA

posted 16 August 2005 06:28 PM     profile     
Larry, and i was feeling sorry for you, man here you have a top notch SHO-BUD, man i ain't feeling sorry no more!!!!!!! farris
Herb Steiner
Member

From: Cedar Valley, Travis County TX

posted 16 August 2005 06:38 PM     profile     
Farris
With you playing it, or with me playing it?
Farris Currie
Member

From: Ona, Florida, USA

posted 16 August 2005 06:45 PM     profile     
HERB we let the previous owner TOMMY WHITE play it hows that!!!! farris
Vance Monday
Member

From: Bella Vista, AR, USA

posted 16 August 2005 07:14 PM     profile     
I have a Professional that I bought new in 1972 and have never had a problem with it. It has been played probably as much as anyones.. I had a dance band for 25 years or more and my wife and I had a music festival for 20 years and the old Sho-Bud had to set out in all kinds of weather.. I thought I would give it a rest and bought a new GFI but couldn't get the same sound, so I bought a Super Pro and it sounds better but not as good as the old Pro.. I do lots of recording sessions and I always play the ole Pro on recordings..It just sounds better...
George Rozak
Member

From: Braidwood, Illinois USA

posted 16 August 2005 08:32 PM     profile     
I vote with Farris. I still have the original Professional that I bought new in 1970.

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Sho-Bud: Professional & Fingertip

JOHN COOP
Member

From: YORKTOWN, IND. USA

posted 17 August 2005 12:18 AM     profile     
My early 64 which belonged to Shot if it were for sale!!! Drool over that one boys! Coop
James Morehead
Member

From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA

posted 17 August 2005 05:45 AM     profile     
Kirk, There's a nice Professional in the buy / sell right now.
James Morehead
Member

From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA

posted 17 August 2005 05:48 AM     profile     
Looks like the Coop scooped it up already. Nice score John!
Marco Schouten
Member

From: Amsterdam, The Netherlands

posted 17 August 2005 11:20 AM     profile     
I have a green Baldwin crossover, converted to SD-10, with Duane Marrs hardware "under the hood".
Pays and sounds like a dream.

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Steelin' Greetings
Marco Schouten
Sho-Bud LLG; Guyatone 6 string lap steel; John Pearse bar; Emmons bar; Evans SE200 amp


Scott Denniston
Member

From: Hahns Peak, Colorado, USA

posted 17 August 2005 09:09 PM     profile     
I'm thinking my Professional is my final choice. It's my fourth steel and it's just a dream (looks, tone & action). It was a junker until Duane & Jeff rebuilt it and it was refinished by AJ Nelson. You know, there are old ones around for relatively cheap that can be made into a new Bud but even better. A lot of "purists" might disagree with me but all I know is that I kept this one for years because I knew it had possibilities. The mechanism was hardly playable and it looked like refried crap. It's now the prettiest, best sounding (with true tone pickups)and smoothest playing steel I've ever known. Period! I'm being objective & I wouldn't say this if it weren't true. But then I'm one who has to plug his ears at most of what I hear on the radio.
Leon Roberts
Member

From: Tallahassee,FL USA

posted 17 August 2005 10:17 PM     profile     
Being a Sho-Bud player for 35+ years, any stock D-10 will feel natural. As for what’s the best one to buy be my guest. I have three Sho-Buds and none are “factory stock’ There is no factory stock Sho-Bud that I would play at the present time, knowing what I know now.

Let me start with the infamous “rack and barrel” system. This system is an antiquated mechanical system and adds absolutely nothing to the sound of the older Sho-Buds. It might be adequate if you desire to be a Lloyd Green clone, but if you want to survive in a cover band playing all the licks that come out of Nashville, good luck. Try synching this up on a RKL on a Rack and Barrel system.
1st string whole tone raise
2nd string half tone raise
6th string whole tone lower, plain string
3rd string the C-6th neck, whole tone lower.
On a rack and barrel system you will feel each pull activate until you reach the stop. This I can not endure.
This isn’t an unusual knee lever pull. I would bet most of the weekend pickers have this knee lever on their guitars. I would think it would be an absolute necessity for a road picker out of Nashville.
However, if you think the rack and barrel system will make you sound out of this world, be my guest.

In my opinion the reason the older Sho-Buds had a sweet tone was “ALUMINUM CHANGERS”. That’s what I’m saying. Sho_Bud lost that tone when they started using the Chrome plated Zinc changers. The two hole pullers made the action a little smoother, but the sound was not what the older guitars were.

I found out that Sho-Bud installed aluminum changers in their endorsee guitars. Even the SuperPro players had aluminum changers in their guitars. All of us other suckers bought the Sho-Buds with the “cap pistol” changers with the chrome plating.

My first effort to improve my Sho-Buds was to make them play with the same easy action as the Franklin Guitar. Somewhere around 1983-84, Kevin Ryan brought his brand spanking new FRANKLIN over to my apartment for me to adjust the return compensators. Mr Franklin had the compensators properly adjusted when the guitar was shipped but Kevin turned the wrong nylon tuners on the 4th string. Having compromised the settings on the return compensators, nothing he tried would arrive at the results he desired. The part that simply awes me is the fact that Kevin could tell that the string was not returning to proper pitch with just his ear. I would die for an ear like that. Kevin finally gave up and brought the guitar to me. I used a Korg AT-12 tuner and adjusted the return compensators. After I had the guitar all setup, I played it for awhile. It simply blew my mind how easy the FRANKLIN guitar played. So I started modifying my Sho-Buds to duplicate the action that impressed me. It has been a never ending quest but I have finally arrived with the results I wanted. My first big change was installing triple raise and double lower changers. The next big change was installing 14 whole pulling fingers like the later Emmons guitars. The guitars played like butter, but I still didn’t have the “sound” I wanted. My good Friend Albert Johnson suggested and made some changers from 6061 aluminum. We put them on my early 70’s Pro-III. I couldn’t believe the difference in the tone. When I bought my Professional a year ago, I removed and threw away most of the antiquated under carriage. It took some machining but I adapted it for triple raise, double lower changers with the aluminum uppers. I had Dana Flood to play the guitar before and after the conversion. Dana, Albert Johnson and I all agreed that the guitar sounded better after the conversion. All three of my Sho-Buds have aluminum changers and 14 whole pulling fingers.

That’s all I’ve got to say about Sho-Buds.

[This message was edited by Joey Ace on 18 August 2005 at 06:40 AM.]

Leon Roberts
Member

From: Tallahassee,FL USA

posted 17 August 2005 10:44 PM     profile     
I'm soory guys. I tried to edit my above post but no joy. I might have a virus so I'll wipe my hard drive clean and start over. I'll check in ???????
Leon
Tony Prior
Member

From: Charlotte NC

posted 18 August 2005 02:13 AM     profile     
Leons post, and I read it all,( then took a nap ) about the Professionals I think is 100% on the money.

If you are asking about obtainig A Steel for the pleasure of owning a Classic /Collectable then the D10 Professional is a wise choice.

BUT..

My opinion ( like it matters) is that it is NOT a road worthy or GIG worthy guitar, meaning by todays configuration standards..

IF you are playing an extended configuration , like Leon mentions above, and are looking for a Guitar to match the one you have with an extended setup, it probably ain't gonna happen with an old Professional.

When I had mine, I loved it..but 8+2 was not gonna make it. I purchased all the parts to add another 2 levers but reality landed on my head and I decided to sell it ..and did.

And of course the arguement of "You don't need the extended configuration " always shows up and that is true..if you don't play an extended set up with multiple knee levers and changes.

IF you are playing a 9+8 setup..8+2 is not gonna make you happy...

IF looking at a beautiful old Professional is gonna make you happy then there ya go..

For me, A D10 Super Pro would be the ticket ...or a rebuilt Pro-II or Pro III with the same changes that I use now...

Farris Currie
Member

From: Ona, Florida, USA

posted 18 August 2005 05:53 AM     profile     
Don't think any room left to post after Leon finished!!!!hahahhaaha man talk about getting your point accross!!!
Why sure,i'm 64 don't go out much any more,and hooked on old professional SHO-BUD.
For me thats the sound i prefer!! but set up right for a person like me they are a keeper. I have the Black one i just bought, came off the GRAND OLD OPRY,Tommy White played it many times on there,don't need nothing!!!!There are some good ones
farris
Gary Spaeth
Member

From: Wisconsin, USA

posted 18 August 2005 06:18 AM     profile     
i thought i was watching "run lola run" for a minute. ha ha
James Morehead
Member

From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA

posted 18 August 2005 06:27 AM     profile     
Playing that old rack and barrel hasn't slowed Ricky Davis down one bit. The old Buds are not for everyone. But they work great if you understand how they work. There are upgrades that will make them nicer yet and more player friendly. Bottom line to me, every guitar has quirks, and you still have to learn any of them. The new modern guitars cut through the chase faster, with many improvements. What ever you play, there are pro's and con's and trade offs.
Joey Ace
Sysop

From: Southern Ontario, Canada

posted 18 August 2005 06:44 AM     profile     
I edited Leon's Post.

For those who didn't see it the first time, it was exactly what is there now, only repeated FIVE times, due to a computer problem.

Lotsa good info there, thanks Leon.

Kirk Hamre
Member

From: Birmingham, Alabama

posted 18 August 2005 09:48 AM     profile     
Thanks to all who have replied here. I need to add to my original question: My reason for buying a Double Neck Sho bud was two-fold: 1. I love the look and tone, and 2. I hope to have Duane Marrs completely restore the finish and hardware. Does Duane Marrs use the aluminum changers you spoke of Leon? How does the Marrs hardware measure-up to the old Sho Bud hardware? I like the old style tear-drop Sho Bud knee levers and the left knee left lever that is mounted at an angle to better follow the natural swing of your left leg, does anyone know if Marrs can supply this angled set-up?

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2001 Emmons Lashley LeGrande II, Model LST10L, E9th Single 10 String on a Double Frame with pad, 3 Pedals, 5 Knees, RKR is a double stop. 2005 Peavey Nashville 1000 Amp. Boss GE-7 Equalizer. Sho Bud Volume Pedal.

Ricky Davis
Moderator

From: Spring, Texas USA

posted 18 August 2005 10:05 AM     profile     
quote:
I like the old style tear-drop Sho Bud knee levers and the left knee left lever that is mounted at an angle to better follow the natural swing of your left leg, does anyone know if Marrs can supply this angled set-up?

marrsofmadison@aol.com can answer those questions for ya.
Ricky
Skip Edwards
Member

From: LA,CA

posted 18 August 2005 01:11 PM     profile     
I think that between Duane Marrs, John Coop and Ricky Davis, Sho-Buds are (or can be) better now than they ever were.
PAUL WARNIK
Member

From: OAK LAWN,IL,USA

posted 19 August 2005 12:24 PM     profile     
I have owned at least twenty Sho-Buds of every model from Maverick to Super Pro-IMHO The early Pr-II I currenty own is the best one of all of them
Ernest Cawby
Member

From: Lake City, Florida, USA

posted 19 August 2005 02:26 PM     profile     
Don't tell me that I want it to be the pro 1

ernie

Eric West
Member

From: Portland, Oregon, USA

posted 21 August 2005 10:06 AM     profile     
If you can find one, a ProIII with wide pedals.

Trouble free, no rebuilding, and those John Coop replacement parts are probably the best you'll find.

Sometimes people dis the plated fingers and other parts.

Mine lasted the best part or more than 3000 bar bush league gigs. Probably two thousand of them before any holes started getting egg shaped, or indentatinos appeared in the fingers to the point where I noticed, and If'n I'd have kept it out of the weather, musty car trunks and oiled it it'd have lasted longer. Then there were the beer baptisms it got on a bi-yearly basis.

I"ve seen a number of them sell lately for good prices.

If you buy a Professional, it's a crap shoot. Some of them were different.Some of the years had split axles and the baskets already were a touchy deal. The one I sent to Duane and Jeff to become a Super Marrs~Bud would have been a nightmare to get working again.

JMHO

EJL

Herb Steiner
Member

From: Cedar Valley, Travis County TX

posted 21 August 2005 12:51 PM     profile     
I would add Jeff Surratt in with the Sho~Bud restoration/upgrade gurus right now. He's working with Duane Marrs.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association


Leon Roberts
Member

From: Tallahassee,FL USA

posted 22 August 2005 05:30 PM     profile     
Thanks Tony, Tha't what I was trying to say,
Leon

[This message was edited by Leon Roberts on 22 August 2005 at 06:09 PM.]

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