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Author
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Topic: Need Pickup Help
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Danny Letz
Member From: Old Glory,Texas, USA 79540
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posted 06 April 2006 05:15 PM
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Guys I need help choosing a pickup. I'm not interested in what your favorite pickup is, but rather what you think would be the best one for me. Here's a little history. I have an 89 Zum S-10 with a E-66. I have a 2003 D-10 Zum with stock Zum pickups. I also have an early D-10 JCH with some kind of Lawrence pickups I think. The S-10 Zum with The E-66 Is probably the closest to what I want, but not quite there. The JCH sounds pretty good, but I think the pickups have gotten old. I am playing the S-10 Zum and the Nashville 112 the most because of the weight and simplicity. I work on guitars for friends and a Legrand III with wood necks may be the best sounding guitar I have worked on. I am not interested in trading guitars, but just want the best sound I can get out of what I have. I know most of it is in your hands and technique. I don't want to start that argument again. I work with my tone controls on the amp constantly, but end up back in the same favorite adjustments all the time, so I think I have optimized the amp. I can get a good sound out of the bigger strings, it's the little ones I have trouble with. I don't like the real tinny high end. I like the sound of the push pull Emmons. I like the Buddy Emmons sound. I like The John Hughey sound, more so on recordings than live. I think Randy Beavers has one of the best sounds at the Texas show. Now using all this information, what pickups would you recommend for my Zums. I'm not crazy about changing them more that once. I also have a Nashville 400 with Lemay Mod, a Profex II, thru a Stewart 200 and 15" Black Widow. None of these get much better that the Nashville 112.[This message was edited by Danny Letz on 06 April 2006 at 05:17 PM.] |
Billy Carr
Member From: Seminary, Mississippi USA
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posted 06 April 2006 10:36 PM
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XR-16's work for me. The Zum is one the finest built guitars on the market. I do believe the overall sound is in the way each guitar is built. The first thing I do with a guitar when I want to see what it really sounds like is, I play the guitar through a good steel amp with no effects other than a little reverb. Either it's what I'm looking for or it's not. Some guitars have and some don't. I also think S-10's, S-12's & D-10's all offer something special in there own way. |
Dag Wolf
Member From: Bergen, Norway
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posted 07 April 2006 05:19 AM
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Danny,
You say you like the sounds of John H. and Buddy E.
I belive that both of them have the pickups wound more on the heavy side.
Johns Zum have 20.000 ohms which I think is pretty heavy or bassy. I think Buddys pickups are too tho` he have humbuckers in his legrande.In the S-10 Zum you have E-66. If you go for 10-1 GL`s you will get less highs than the E-66 and get a closer sound to what you describe. Give Bruce Zumsteg a call and he will help you out.
He knows more than anyone how to get what you`re looking for in a Zum. Good luck. Dag[This message was edited by Dag Wolf on 07 April 2006 at 05:21 AM.] |
Morton Kellas
Member From: Chazy, NY, USA 12921
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posted 07 April 2006 07:05 AM
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Danny, Both John and Randy use Wallace single coil pickups in their double neck Zums. I have a 2005 Zum SD-10 with a Wallace single coil pickup wound to 18K and it sounds sweet. I have another Zum comming in May which will have a Wallace pickup as well. I think single coils give you the best overall tone if you don't mind a little hum. Perhaps you can find someone who will let you borrow one to try. If I had an extra one, I would let you try it. Good luck. |
Tim Bridges
Member From: Hoover, Alabama, USA
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posted 07 April 2006 07:23 AM
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I have a TT that was just rewound by Jerry. I recieved a U12 Zum with a TT wound to 17.5 kohms. It would cut through like a single coil, but the bottom end was thin as well as the midrange. I spoke with Bruce and Jerry. We decided on 20-20.5 kohms. In the interim, I used a BL 912 humbucker. Very quiet and a good sounding pickup. I replaced the BL with the newly wound TT the day I got it. The difference is what I wanted to hear. My personal preference would be the TT wound according to what you want to hear. As stated above, the higher the resistance, the more body is achieved for the full range of frequencies. |
David Wren
Member From: Placerville, California, USA
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posted 07 April 2006 10:31 AM
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quote:
I do believe the overall sound is in the way each guitar is built.
My friend Chris Ivey told me he put pickups from a Emmons on his Zum, and could hardly tell any difference at all.... so I think what Billy said may have a lot of truth to it. ------------------
Dave Wren
'95Carter S12-E9/B6,7X7; Twin Session 500s; Hilton Pedal; Black Box
www.ameechapman.com
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John De Maille
Member From: Merrick,N.Y. U.S.A.
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posted 07 April 2006 02:00 PM
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I believe Randy's True Tone pickups are wound to 17,500 on his Zum. I have a True Tone wound to 19,500 on my U-12 Zum. My Zum started with a BL 912, but, was a little to dark sounding for me. TT are the way to go. |
Roger Crawford
Member From: Locust Grove, GA USA
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posted 07 April 2006 07:19 PM
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TT's @18.5k |
Chuck McGill
Member From: Jackson, Tn
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posted 08 April 2006 05:41 AM
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I like the True tone 17.5k on the Uni Zum in my shop. The easiest way to get Randy Beavers tone is let him play your guitar. |
Daniel J. Cormier
Member From: Lake Charles, LA, USA
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posted 08 April 2006 06:40 AM
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TrueTone wound at 17.5 to 18 ohms sound great in any guitar. But you will always have the noise that comes with a single coil pickup. BL XR-16's or the new George L Eon sound great will get you close to the same sound without the noise.Always remember that the right hand has a lot to do with your tone.Some guy's can get almost the same tone out of Carter with LXR-16's or Eon's as another guy playing a P/P through the same amp.I can play on the same rig as Martin Broussard or David Higginbottham and not get the same tone they do.Ain't tone a fickle thing |
John Bechtel
Member From: Nashville, Tennessee,U.S.A.
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posted 08 April 2006 08:00 PM
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The E-66 is wound to 17,500. What you need to try for the sound that you want is the Geo.L. 10-1, which is wound at 19,500.------------------
“Big John”
a.k.a. {Keoni Nui}
Current Equipment
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John Bechtel
Member From: Nashville, Tennessee,U.S.A.
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posted 08 April 2006 09:47 PM
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Morton;
The last time I saw and spoke to John Hughey, (about 3-wks ago) I asked him what he had in his ZumSteel and he told me he was using Original Emmons P/U's! This week, who knows? He likes to try a variety of P/U's! Last Winter I bought a Geo.L. 10-1 that came out of one of his guitars!------------------
“Big John”
a.k.a. {Keoni Nui}
Current Equipment
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Danny Letz
Member From: Old Glory,Texas, USA 79540
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posted 09 April 2006 07:01 PM
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I'm kind of leaning to trying a George L 10-1. My good friend Bobby Rains tryed lots of pickups on his Rains prototype and at that time his opinion was that the 10-1 sounded best on his guitar. May have changed his mind by now. I like some bite in the pickup, but I think that a couple of good sounding guitars I played had wood necks probably means I lean to a little mellower sound. I have a good friend who is strictly a pick blocker, who likes the sound of the Zum with the stock Zum pickups. I think they are single coils, but they haven't ever hummed. Guys, I sure have appreciated your opinions and wouldn' mind hearing some more.[This message was edited by Danny Letz on 09 April 2006 at 07:02 PM.] |
Jennings Ward
Member From: Edgewater, Florida, USA
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posted 09 April 2006 07:56 PM
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THIS IS NOT MENT TO BE INSULTING OR BE A WISE A$$...I BELIEVE SAID ANOTHER WAY,,, " I DONT REALLY KNOW WHAT TONE I WANT TO GET"""
MAY I SUGGEST, JUST FOR OUR EDIFICATION WE TRY PLAYING THE FIDDLE, MOT SO MUCH FOR THE MUSIC, BUT TO UNDERSTAND HOW WE GET "TONE", AND THE IMPORTANCE OF GOOD TECHNIQUE....THIS IS ALL IMPORTANT, MAYBE THE MOST IMPORTANT, WHEN TRYING TO DEVELOPE TONE.....AS FAR AS MECHANICS
GO, HAND EXERCISES , A MUST, AKA WELDON MYRICK..BUY YOURSELF A 31 BAND EQ, PUT IT IN SERIES WITH YOUR STEEL AND AMP.....IF WHAT I HAVE JUST SAID DONT DO THE TRICK, WELL ??
I AM SURE THAT YOU HAVE HEARD PEOPLE WITH A GOOD VOICE TRY TO SING, BUT IT WAS TERRABLE, BECAUSE THEY DID NOT KNOW HOW TO CONTRIL OR USE THEIR VOICE...STEEL PLAYING THE SAME.....
JENNINGS,,U PK;;;;;;;;------------------
EMMONS D10 10-10 profex 2 deltafex ne1000 pv1000, pv 31 bd eq, + |
Chris LeDrew
Member From: Newfoundland, Canada
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posted 09 April 2006 08:19 PM
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I think Jennings is onto something...........my Boss GE-7 graphic EQ will give me pretty much whatever I want out of a pickup......highs, lows, and "honk". I think I read somewhere that Buddy Emmons considered a graphic EQ the secret weapon in his seat, or something to that effect. I believe it was an older article, but I know why he thought so highly of the EQ. IMHO, a half-decent equalizer can make any amp into a steel amp - with a few adjustments. But this is about pickups........I digress. |
Tim Bridges
Member From: Hoover, Alabama, USA
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posted 10 April 2006 07:01 AM
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A decent EQ will allow you more flexablity. I use a MB Studio Preamp and have tried both humbuckers and single coil pickups. Whether you choose to agree, or not, they sound different. You can't make a humbucker sound like a single coil, or vice versa. I guess that's why I prefer a Tele with single coils vs. a Tele with humbuckers (eventhough they have coil tapping, or split coils). IMO, the single coils have more punch and cut through better. I just had my TT rewound from 17.5 kohms to ~19.5-20 kohms for my U12 Zum. It was a huge difference!I'll take the hum issue and the sound of a single coil wound appropriately. Of course, this is my personal preference. AND, I do agree that the right player can make any guitar sound great! I look at this instrument and the gear like I do golf. You can buy a few more yards with the right club(s), the right ball, under the right conditions. You can shave a few strokes by acquiring the best gear. It all plays into the psyche. BUT, you won't become a scratch golfer without the gift and alot of dedication and hard work. |
Danny Letz
Member From: Old Glory,Texas, USA 79540
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posted 10 April 2006 06:44 PM
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As I said in one of my other posts, I know that most of the tone is in your hands and techniqe. No arguement.. But how do explain what I said about playing some of my friends guitars that I was working on and they sounded good? That's my same pair of hands and techniqe that I always use. Maybe my guitars can't be made to sound that good. I'm just trying to improve. I might try the Boss equilizer, I have one, but I'm not really wanting to add more equipment to the load. I admit that I'm not a real good player, but I do know what sounds good and I just trying to improve. As one musician told me, when you get really good equipment, all your old excuses are gone. |
Dan Burnham
Member From: Martin, Tennessee, USA
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posted 11 April 2006 06:45 AM
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Danny,
I'd suggest calling Gene Turner out of Mayfield Kentucky. 1.270.247.5876 Gene is an awesome engineer when it comes to all the specs. Bobbe Seymour has Gene wind all his pickups. You said you liked the sound of the Emmons, Gene can wind it to sound just like the Emmons. He just finished my 14 string pickup. Gene is very knowledgeable and has a full understanding how Ron Lashley wound the pickups for the Emmons.
Dan |
Morton Kellas
Member From: Chazy, NY, USA 12921
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posted 11 April 2006 08:08 AM
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Hey John, Your right. When I spoke to Bruce last week, he said John had TT pickups wound to around 20K. John always sounds good. For those of you who say tone is in the hands, that is true. It is also true that certain pickups have different voiceings which may help you aquire the sound you are looking for. That is why so many pro's experiment with different pickups. |
Danny Letz
Member From: Old Glory,Texas, USA 79540
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posted 11 April 2006 11:50 AM
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Still leaning towards a George L 10-1 or maybe a Truetone wound about the same. Without bothering Bruce, does anyone know what the stock Zum is wound to. It's a 2003. |
Tim Bridges
Member From: Hoover, Alabama, USA
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posted 12 April 2006 02:29 PM
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You can look on the bottom of the pickup, or put a meter on the jack leads and measure it. Bruce will put whatever pickup you want. I spoke with him recently about my U12, TT pickup wound at 17.5 kohms. He, and jerry Wallace, recommended 19.5-20.0 kohms for what I wanted. You want yours wound higher if you want to bring out the wound strings. For an E9th, I would bet 18.5-20.0 kohms; depending on how you want it to "voice" your string. The GL 10-1 is a very warm pickup. |
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