In another thread, Richard Burton wrote

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I've noticed an annoying tone problem on the fourth (E) string on every steel I've had.
It's not an increase in volume, it's the tailing of of the note into an irritating whine.

My solution, which I've used for many years, but may not be applicable to the Fender 2000, was to put a thin sliver of plastic between the string and the changer finger, to shorten the decay of the note.

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I have the same problem, especially after the note decays for a second or so. It's worst on string 4 around fret 8, but it happens on all the little plain strings to some extent. It's better on the Franklin and GFI, worse on the Zum and Sho-Bud-Marrs. Bruce Zumsteg says he has looked unsuccesfully for a solution.

A drop of oil doesn't help.

Temporary solutions include:

1. Pushing the string sideways (good for one take or so until it slides back.)

2. Sanding/polishing the finger surface with 1500 sandpaper, and a wadding polish. This may allow some hours or days of better sound, but of course you must be careful to keep what you scrape off from getting in the bearing. And you must be very careful to maintain a round shape lest you make it even flatter somewhere.

I think a smaller radius on the finger would be a better solution, but surely this has been tried and rejected, because all my steels seem to have the same radius.

I am reluctant to try Richard's solution because I can't find a really thin piece of plastic just now and I think it must spoil the sound.

[This message was edited by Jon Light on 13 May 2006 at 08:24 AM.]

I have had this whine as most probably have.
Recently I played with some other guys that play a much higher volume in a different room and it made it sound better.
amp settings, room acoustics, picking habits, I have had problems tuning then figured out I was sitting near a ceiling fan causing an out of tune effect wah wah wah wah
Remember a fine whine will get better over time.
P.S. Loved your work in Mc Hales Navy

Another method that works equally well, but is messier, is a thin smear of grease on the string/finger interface.

Please don't laugh, it really does work !!

Apply a bit of grease, and pluck the string.

If the string is too muted, wipe a small amount of grease off, and pluck again.

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But why, Earnest, do you think it is worse on some guitars? Softer metal on the fingers?

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My newer ones aren't better than old ones. The old Franklin is better than the new Marrs fingers.

Does every builder use the same material? When I saw grooves appearing in my almost-new Zumsteel I asked Bruce why he didn't use a harder material, and he said it sounds worse. But I wonder if the real reason is that it is harder to work with.

I haven't noticed that problem on any new guitars. I believe there are two causes:
1. crud under the string
2. microgrooves in the radius of the finger

Whenever I notice that problem I change the string. B4 installing the new one I examine the top of the finger. I always rub it out with a pencil eraser. If I can SEE a groove I'll get a bit more aggressive and either use a typewriter eraser or a Dremel with a little buffing wheel and some buffing compound. B4 putting the new string on I'll polish it out with semichrome or a Blitz cloth. Sometimes those little grooves are REALLY HARD TO SEE. Run your fingernail across the finger perpendicular to the direction the string goes across it. You may be able to feel it even if you can't see it.

Crud under the string can also be sneaky -- you may not see it easily. I've found that when my guitar starts playing 'Norwegian Wood', loosening it and cleaning it and the top of the finger with a Blitz cloth then a clean cloth USUALLY solves the problem unless the string is ANCIENT. In that case, I'll break down and change the string.

As with all things pedal steel: YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY.

Maybe we could paint the metal with something sticky that dries extremely hard.

[This message was edited by Earnest Bovine on 13 May 2006 at 11:00 AM.]

All of the suggestions except putting dunnage under the strings are worthy for temp fixes.

Had I to do it over again, after "regrooving" it a few times after a few years it's easy enough to just replace the offending changers.

I got a couple extras for my poor old PIII and when and if I get time I'll put them in. It was only the B and G#s. I reckon my Marrs has a few years on it before it starts happening.

Also mentioned a while ago was that most "grooving" happens when something slams into the strings and drives them into the fingers.

Early on I isolated a lot my buzzing to the nut and foolishly peened the aluminum next to the rollers. It worked though. Then I thought about winding the strings so they pulled at an angle.

A lot of it is like "fret buzz" on a tele. It goes away at beer glass melting volume...

I have to keep myself away from my allen wrenches when I'm at home for that reason, and at the gig and stage or recording volume it goes away.

What's wrong with "annoying"?

Or, maybe a little piece of black electricians' tape will work?

[This message was edited by Cliff Kane on 13 May 2006 at 04:49 PM.]

Yours is the best looking guitar I've seen on the forum. A steel w/o a reel is like a day w/o sunshine.

Moral: You're the only one who probably hears all those little overtones, buzzes, and whines, anyway. Your time would be better spent trying to learn to play, and not worrying about those thousands of "little quirks" that you think keep you from sounding like Buddy or Lloyd.

Since I started changing the strings at shorter intervals the probelm has diminished for me. Would be interesting to hear from a builder on this.... must be a major consideration in design. I've noticed some changers on the newer makes of PSG have the rear of the finger slanted at angle, rather than a vertical 90 degree... this seems like a good idea, but haven't heard anyone on this forum comment on this design change?

Hey Jon, no need to tell you to "get reel"

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Dave Wren
'96 Carter S12-E9/B6,7X7; Twin Session 500s; Hilton Pedal; Black Box
www.ameechapman.com

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some changers on the newer makes of PSG have the rear of the finger slanted at angle, rather than a vertical 90 degree... this seems like a good idea, but haven't heard anyone on this forum comment on this design change?

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