 Topic Closed
|
 The Steel Guitar Forum
 Steel Players
 Juuust about had it....... (Page 1)
|
| This topic is 2 pages long: 1 2 |
next newest topic | next oldest topic |
| Author | Topic: Juuust about had it....... |
|
Jeff Peterson Member From: Nashville, TN USA |
posted 18 March 2002 06:56 PM
profile
See ya'. [This message was edited by Jeff Peterson on 20 March 2002 at 05:36 AM.] |
|
Dave Van Allen Member From: Doylestown, PA , US , Earth |
posted 18 March 2002 07:23 PM
profile
thanks Jeff! Words to live by, like: Live and let live. and Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. and Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
Shut up and play yer guitar |
|
Jerry Hedge Member From: Norwood Ohio U.S.A. |
posted 18 March 2002 07:29 PM
profile
Jeff,AMEN!!! Think about the many people that have knocked the players for just making a living. I'm sure that those who work a day job don't tell the boss how to run the company!!! Now,I don't like the way most Country Radio sounds today BUT it isn't the fault of the musicians. You are just doing your job. In fact instead of knocking the guys in your position we SHOULD BE CONGRATULATING YOU!!! Guys like you had the gonads to go to Nashville and try to make a living with this crazy instrument. How many of us would be this brave and take the chance of either making it as a road musician or if you were LUCKY enough a studio musician? |
|
Ron Whitworth Member From: Yuma,Ariz. USA |
posted 18 March 2002 07:55 PM
profile
BRAVO JEFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You sure said a mouthfull there that (imho) needs to be said here..We are growing by leaps & bounds on this Forum every day but it seems to me a LOT of the full time pro's are leaving in bunches too..I think they just get tired of arguing & having to defend their way of making a living every time they come on here..We ALL have our "favorite" brand or style of music..I would surely think that we would have learned by now you just can't force that on anybody else.I think everyone should PLEASE take a minute & re-read Jeff's post at the top here..He has said everything that needs to be said & maybe we can all start enjoying this GREAT steel forum more if we would all just take a minute before we fly off the handle & start typing(myself included too)..Thanks Ron |
|
Jerry Hayes Member From: Virginia Beach, Va. |
posted 18 March 2002 07:56 PM
profile
Hey Jeff, Well said for sure! I'm an old 62 year old geezer who quit playing full time about 16 years ago when I moved from LA to Virginia. I love the old stuff without question as Ralph Mooney is my personal hero but, I love the new stuff too! I'm glad I had my career on the west coast where we were always a little more tolerant of other types of music than back here. We always incorporated rock, bluegrass, swing, jazz, or anything else we liked into what we were doing. I've seen some fine young players on the Opry and other shows and videos who are great players. It seems that a lot of those on the Forum want the music to stay the way it was and not evolve like all other types of music did. Listen to Roy Acuff in 1940, that was state of the art country music then. Even Ernest Tubb's music evolved from the 40's till the end of his career. It got a whole lot more polished and up to date. I do however miss the TNN version of the Opry, not because the music was different but because they didn't have all the interviews and such. You just saw the Opry as it was and didn't miss any of the music. I wish that CMT would show a whole hour of the complete show. In closing, I think that acts like Brooks & Dunn, Ol' Garth, Ricochet, Trisha Yearwood, or any of 'em as as legitimate as anything in country music's past. I even liked Gram Parsons, Poco, The Flying Burrito Bros. and acts like that. ------------------ |
|
John Macy Member From: Denver, CO USA |
posted 18 March 2002 09:20 PM
profile
Dang it Jeff, I told you to lay off those hot wings...  |
|
Bob Hoffnar Member From: Brooklyn, NY |
posted 18 March 2002 09:27 PM
profile
I am amazed at how forthcoming guys on the forum are about things they have no direct experience of. I figure you gotta gig or you don't gotta gig. The rest is just sillyness. Bob |
|
JB Arnold Member From: Longmont,Co,USA |
posted 18 March 2002 09:52 PM
profile
Amen.
------------------ |
|
chas smith Member From: Encino, CA, USA |
posted 18 March 2002 10:08 PM
profile
I love and respect the "old", I support and play the "new". I don't see them as being mutually exclusive, it's music. |
|
Del Rangel Member From: Sacramento, CA, USA |
posted 18 March 2002 10:14 PM
profile
Dave Van Allen is right. Live and let live and never assume things are coming to an end. I have not been around as long as many of you, but in my short lifetime there have been several transitions in all genres of music, and C&W is no exception. Some of you remember when the "Nashville Sound" of the 1950s caused a stir. My first rememberances of Country was listening to music out of Bakersfield as a kid and my father laughed about how guys like Buck Owens and Merle Haggard flipped some folks out in the 1960s. By the 1970s and 1980s, Country had a rebellious streak appear in full bloom with Willie, Waylon, Hank Jr. and the likes of David Allen Coe. Everyone was sure that "real" country was dead as these Rocker "wannabes" were killing it--or so the story went. By the 1980s and 1990s many started to complain about the lifestyle in Nashville and in Country music and some Like Waylon Jennings even sang about "Did Ole Hank really do it this way." Again, some spoke of the death of country, but it continued. More recently, while many people in corporate Nashville, New York, and LA ignored American culture in the form of traditional Country music a couple of whacked-out directors re-cast Homer's Odyssey to the musical backdrop of some of the best artists this country can offer, and the executives that were paying attention ended up scoring big with the O' Brother Were Art Thou soundtrack. The fact is a lot of people are still listening to country music, and while the corporate stranglehold needs to be loosened, time usually does that anyway. The corporations biggest problem is that they are like the old baronial class--willing to wipe one another out for a few bucks and a promise. New people are coming up and will figure things out. For instance where I teach history, the college paper now regularly reviews Country as well as Other types of CD releases. Five years ago this was not the case. Some that I have seen in the recent past have included artists like Alison Krauss and Kasey Chambers. Maybe some of you don't like the "new" music, or the new corporate format, but country is alive and well and by all accounts growing in popularity again. So hang on, because the train is moving and it won't stop for any of us mere mortals. |
|
LARRY COLE Member From: COLUMBUS, OHIO, USA |
posted 18 March 2002 10:20 PM
profile
Jeff, am I missing something? What does the BREAKING EVEN have to do with blasting the Opry? ------------------ |
|
Tony Prior Member From: Charlotte NC |
posted 19 March 2002 04:30 AM
profile
Jeff, well written , but I to am a little confused. The Opry deal is a conversation about " Not enough music" being shown on the TV portion of the show. I'm not certain I read anywhere where the players are being criticized. As far as breaking even, I broke even on my very fist gig when I was 14, no amount of money could ever replace that or any of the gigs I have played thru the last 38 years. I think I'm pretty much like most here, I earn a living at my day gig and keep my sanity ( edge) by playing with the band, whether it's for money of not ! TP |
|
Paul Graupp Member From: Macon Ga USA |
posted 19 March 2002 05:45 AM
profile
I'm reminded of a local musician, a singer from Macon, GA who went up to the Big City and was going to do it his way. I never heard of him again. You do have to live and let live. I always thought that was a given !! Regards, Paul |
|
bob drawbaugh Member From: scottsboro, al. usa |
posted 19 March 2002 06:05 AM
profile
Jeff, you as a pro may not have much to say about the music industry. But, you and I as consumers should have a lot to say about it. We should vote every chance we get, with or money,phone ,the forum,letters. So what you see as bashing, I may see as consumer watching. JMHO. |
|
Bill Simmons Member From: Keller, Texas, USA |
posted 19 March 2002 07:43 AM
profile
I'm like Tony Prior in that I'm confused about such an intense response from Jeff regarding the attack on the younger players etc. My interpretation of what players have been expressing is their concern about the direction of the Opry, the demise of TNN (Country Music)and/or the general questions and comments about the direction of country music in general and not an attack on the creative, younger players. I believe the bottom line is everyone expressing their thoughts because they care and love the steel guitar. It is voiced in a concern as consumers as well as a musicians. Over the past few years, it has been apparent that even the people at the top of the country music business have been struggling with the direction of the Opry and country music. Maybe there was another thread where someone was bashing the musicians etc, especially the younger players that I missed. If that is so, then I would understand Jeff's response. However, whether one makes a living as a 'Pro' or is simply a 'bedroom picker', I believe everyone is on the same page in that they love the steel guitar and appreciate the diversity of the styles of music involving the steel. I have a number of 'pro' musicians (steel players)in Nashville and they haved voiced their concern about the future of country music/Opry and the direction of where those in power will take it. The seasoned session players that I know appreciate the talented younger players and are pretty open to helping them in any way. Everyone knows that life is about change and that you must anticipate it and adapt with it. By the way, the Ft Worth newspaper had an interesting interview article this past weekend about the English gentleman in charge of Gaylord. It sounded like they 'listened' to the many voices who expressed their concern, especially about the WSM station format etc, and even tho they lost some big money,it appears they believe in WSM and the Opry for the future. He aluded to their 'learning' as well. Thanks Bob for allowing the forum to be a vehicle to learn, grow, build new friends, express our thoughts etc. By the way, there a number of the "pro" friends, not only in Nashville, but in LA and other cities who I know that read the forum and love it! |
|
Jeff Lampert Member From: queens, new york city |
posted 19 March 2002 08:05 AM
profile
Jeff P., A key theme in you post seems to be this idea about the people on the Forum getting into arguments about the past/present/future of country music, the brands of steel guitar that are played, and other things as well. And you also say that we are keeping many pros off of the Forum because of this propensity to argue and criticize. I think that the nature of any forum is to draw people of like interests who also tend to have strong opinions and want them to be heard. It's the nature of the beast, so to speak. And while we would want all the pros to be taking part in this, and would in fact relish having conversations with them, I just don't think that it's possible to avoid debate and even arguments. Even though many Forumites will back off when a pro makes a point, there are plenty of others who enjoy "mixing it up" with them, as well as everyone else. I think the bottom line is that once you are on the Forum, the distinction between professionals versus the "weekend warriors" is not considered as significant as it would be, say, at a steel guitar convention. Once we're all talking, everyone's going to want to say what they think, and everyone's going to feel that they are right, and some opinions will go against the grain of the pros, as they go against the grain of plenty of other players. And those pros that don't like that will get annoyed, but those that DO like it, will have fun being part of it. And to tell you the truth, while we certainly miss not having more pros on the Forum, THEY are missing out on some great things. There are many real smart insights, and some hysterically funny stuff, and they could be having a blast with the rest of us, arguments and all. |
|
Buddy Emmons Member From: Hermitage, TN USA |
posted 19 March 2002 08:08 AM
profile
All I gathered from Gary's post was that he hates what's going on in an institution he loves. Guess what Gary? Your opinion parallels a four-decade angst we steel players in Nashville had when a camera would pan to a fiddle during a steel solo; so don't feel like the Lone Ranger. I don't give a damn if people disagree with my opinion or don't like something I do. I care about the right to express an opinion and the right to disagree. And personally, I don't give a rat's rear end if the Opry went under tomorrow, but I would care for the musicians and fans I know that would be affected by it. The ironic part of Dave Van Allen's adages is that they apply to either side. If you live long enough, you'll discover that right and wrong is only decided by majority rule. In this case, it's b0b, and until he steps in, I say let the good times roll. |
|
C Dixon Member From: Duluth, GA USA |
posted 19 March 2002 08:30 AM
profile
|
|
Frank Estes Member From: Huntsville, AL |
posted 19 March 2002 08:30 AM
profile
I considered responding to each line, but I do not have the time. In sum, I guess Jeff and some others feel that if one is not a pro, then one does not have the right to an opinion and especially a disagreeable one. :O Sure, some of the comments can be a little insensitive and I doubt it is always intentional (just the nature of writing/education/semantics), but if you compare the civility here with other Net boards, this one is a Sunday School picnic. As for pro participation, I think they are too busy and you can only rehash topics like right-hand technique, who played on what album, what equipment did so-and-so use, etc. only so much. There is no reason to expect free online course material when some pros count on the revenue for selling their courses. When one of the top pros post here, we often engage in what some call "leg-humping." I find that characterization humorous, but is it not better to "give people flowers" while they are living instead of eulogies after that one is gone? I think that it is so cool how Ernie has a place on the Buddy Emmons Web Site to let other great players give some "flowers" to Buddy with their words of true feeling while he is alive. Give honor to whom honor is due! As for trying to understand steel players, I think Tom Bradshaw put it best in the 1975 Guitarist magazine that was reprinted in Winnie Winston's "Pedal Steel Guitar" instruction book: (I can't remember it word for word, but...) "Steel players are pushy, never satisfied...and their wives no they are second." Just think about what type of person it really takes to "gladly" pack and haul all that equipment, set it up and play in front of people and then tear it all down and take it home to practice...I guess we really are NUTS!!! ------------------ |
|
Dave Van Allen Member From: Doylestown, PA , US , Earth |
posted 19 March 2002 08:33 AM
profile
quote: exactly!! thanks for clarifying my point Buddy, better than I did. Free speech is free speech and we can be damn glad we have it. Music is the thing.And like the much debated "tone"- it's subjective.
blah blah blah |
|
BobG Member From: Holmdel, NJ |
posted 19 March 2002 08:58 AM
profile
Jeff, I'm at a total loss here. Can you please tell me what you found so offensive about my "breaking even" thread? |
|
Steve Allison Member From: Eatonton,Ga. U.S.A. |
posted 19 March 2002 09:05 AM
profile
Yep!!!!!!!!! Music is just like Bar-B-Que Sauce! Everybody has there own idea of what it should taste like. There will always be groups of people that will hang out with others that like there kind of sauce! And to all of us older folks who will not go out and purchase the types of music that we enjoy! It is still being made by alot of artists. They are not dead yet! There are some entertainers in the business who have consistently made wonderfull "country music",
|
|
Rick Garrett Member From: Tyler, Texas |
posted 19 March 2002 09:12 AM
profile
Leg Humping? Let the good times roll? This has all the makings of a world class thread. hahaha Oh yeah wheres my coffeeRick Garrett [This message was edited by Rick GM on 19 March 2002 at 09:14 AM.] |
|
Mike Weirauch Member From: Harrisburg, Illinois**The Hub of the Universe |
posted 19 March 2002 09:28 AM
profile
Unless I missed it, I don't ever recall anyone knocking any steel player for playing a particular bad ride on a song. Now a performer that can't sing or doesn't sing country on a totally country stage? Yeah, that's a different story. I usually offer an opinion on threads of that nature and just because I'm always right doesn't make me a bad person!  Naw, it took a lot more than that to make me bad! From what I have read, I think most everyone here is supportive of those who are playing with a big named act and should be. I don't play out often, only when my son has a date, has to work or just doesn't want to which happens maybe once every 6 weeks or so. If any of the road players want to come and hear me play, I can guarentee they will walk away laughing their ass off but at the end of the evening, I've probably had more fun than anyone there. With a few drinks, I get to playing better. With a few more drinks, hell I can damn near sound like Buddy Emmons. A couple more drinks after that and I can dance like Shania Twain! Now, can anyone top that?As for toys vs computers, I'm in pretty fair shape in both departments. Jeff, you know you like my toys, or at least 3 of them! [This message was edited by Mike Weirauch on 19 March 2002 at 09:38 AM.] |
|
Ricky Davis Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA |
posted 19 March 2002 10:17 AM
profile
...."and then controversy and discussion of points can draw them back"......did I see Carl plop a smiley face in there some where???? WELCOME BACK C. Ricky |
|
Don Townsend Member From: Turner Valley, Alberta Canada |
posted 19 March 2002 10:21 AM
profile
Glad to see your smilin' face again, Carl |
|
retcop88 unregistered |
posted 19 March 2002 10:47 AM
I for one have been a basher of the lack of Country talent showing up on the OPRY. shoot I have yet to bash anyones steel solo or backing of any artist.However when distorted guitars and monkey antics assume they are following the guidelines the Opry was established for then so be it, I bash away... get up on a rock stage,blues .Opera(not Opra)or what have you and do cheating heart, shoot they will laugh your a$$ off of it.Stan kenton and Buddy Rich both once said in public . "Country music was garbage" There was a time when you would ask a Country musician what kind of music he played and you would get a reply er Country rock. There was a time when country wasn't consided cool.Now it is because the producers and radio jocks say it is with the $hit they play.To a loyal Country fan his music is and has always been cool to him even before Hee Haw. When a Country picker would try to rock out he would get laughed at .The Opry has never been a big part of my life and never will,and the talent has diminished enough that I can only visualize what it was to others in days past.But it's not about me I believe it is still the strongest foothold to a music that is dying a slow death. However it isn't a natural death it is a homicide by inserted poisons by people who could careless about it's history.By not backing the Artist that can still cut it ,still pack audiences wherever they play. Like Hag,Jones,Nelson and many more play to standing room only because their music WAS and is still good...Country Music shouldn't have been so dependant on Nashville because it was only produced there for sale...The Opry shouldn't die because of business decisions or lack of interest by musicians...It should be because it's fans died or lost interest. If the Opry closed tommorrow then so be it ,It had a great run and nothing is forever here on earth. JMFHO. ------------------ [This message was edited by retcop88 on 19 March 2002 at 10:54 AM.] |
|
Paul Graupp Member From: Macon Ga USA |
posted 19 March 2002 10:48 AM
profile
Thank You cARL !! I posted a reply to BE in another thread that will fit here for you as well..... I'LL BE ALL Warmest Regards, Paul |
|
Theresa Galbraith Member From: Goodlettsville,Tn. USA |
posted 19 March 2002 12:24 PM
profile
I want to hear more Haggard, Tillis, Strait, Jackson, Chestnut, Lovelace, Smith, Carl Smith, Whites,Lawerence, Pillow, Diffie, Morgan,McGraw, & more traditional singers. But, No matter what, they would get slammed by the clothes, singing, music, steel lack of or whatever Matters not, like Buddy said, "it might as well shut down". It would be one less thing to complain about here. No fact, JMHO Theresa [This message was edited by Theresa Galbraith on 19 March 2002 at 12:29 PM.] |
|
B Cole unregistered |
posted 19 March 2002 12:54 PM
Hey Carl glad to see you back we missed you man. And Theresa you have such a nice way of saying things. And who ever wants to argue with Buddy Emmons foolish mistake. |
|
Pat Burns Member From: Branchville, N.J. USA |
posted 19 March 2002 01:27 PM
profile
quote: ...at the risk of being characterized as a leg-humper, that wonderful quote is what I'm carrying away from this topic...unvarnished truth worthy of Machiavelli, cuts to the chase... |
|
Theresa Galbraith Member From: Goodlettsville,Tn. USA |
posted 19 March 2002 02:01 PM
profile
B Cole, I'm not being foolish first of all. Buddy and I are friends. I agree I could give a rat's rear end if the opry went under tommorow, but I would care for the musicians and fans I know that would be affected by it! Theresa |
|
bob drawbaugh Member From: scottsboro, al. usa |
posted 19 March 2002 02:32 PM
profile
I could give a rat's rear end if the opry went under tommorow, and I wouldn't care for the musicians or the fans, I could care less! Companys go under every day, people have to move on to other things, so what. Now is that mean or what. Just tought I would bump it up a notch, BAAM. |
|
B Cole unregistered |
posted 19 March 2002 02:51 PM
Theresa first I wasn't saying you were arguing with Buddy. What I said was it would be real foolish to argue with Buddy meaning no one person. I'm Sorry you took it wrong and maybe I didn't make it clear enough. As far as the opery toot-a loo As far as the musicians they have come and went for many years. I use to work for a trucking co. that went under and took 4 weeks of my pay with it not to mention retirement so no it don't make much diffrence they knew when they took the job there was no long standing contract. It is like a road job your there untill they tire of you. And I can remember some road jobs" no names " where we didn't get paid one star checke out oweing me and a bass player way over 1000 but did we cry yes we did. but it did no good. I just hope for the musicians sake they have a skill to fall back on cause there aint a lot of playiong going on around here. |
|
Frank Parish Member From: Nashville,Tn. USA |
posted 19 March 2002 03:01 PM
profile
It seems I remember a while back a bunch of people bashing the steel player for BR5-49. That wasn't a bashing, it was a malling and uncalled for. I think a public forum is a good thing and I know we all get loose with the keys sometimes and may even say things here that we wouldn't tell someone to their face but if you don't have something good or positive to say why say it? There's nothing positive about bashing somebody no matter how bad you may think they played. Remember it's only your opinion and we all know what that's like. I for one would like to get every steel player from the past and present to get in here and share it with us. Some guys just think differently than I do and have a different outlook that really works. I just want to find what works and anything negative doesn't fit into my plans. Just because you're having a bad day doesn't mean the rest of us want to join you. Something else too, you really show how professional you are when you say something. |
|
Rusty Hurse Member From: Hendesonville, Tn |
posted 19 March 2002 03:26 PM
profile
LET'S ALL STORM THE OPRY ONE NITE AND JUST TAKE OVER.ROTFLMAO.HEADLINES READ -_-CRAZED MOB OF STEELGUITARIST TAKEOVER GAYLORD. FILM AT 11:00 |
|
B Cole unregistered |
posted 19 March 2002 04:43 PM
Rusty you name the day |
|
B Cole unregistered |
posted 19 March 2002 04:45 PM
Rusty you name the Day and well have Emmons lead the pack And bobb--eee Sizemore can fuirnish the guitars and the picks and bars [This message was edited by B Cole on 20 March 2002 at 06:46 AM.] |
|
Larry Miller Member From: Gladeville,TN.USA |
posted 19 March 2002 05:31 PM
profile
Will Smiley furnish the derbys? |
|
Joey Ace Sysop From: Southern Ontario, Canada |
posted 19 March 2002 05:41 PM
profile
Ya know Rusty, we just might be able to do it!  Thank God for the Internet.Great to see you back, Carl! |
This topic is 2 pages long: 1 2 All times are Pacific (US) | next newest topic | next oldest topic |
 |
|
Contact Us | The Pedal Steel Pages
Note: Messages not explicitly copyrighted are in the Public Domain.
Powered by Infopop www.infopop.com © 2000
Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.46