calvin

[This message was edited by Calvin Walley on 01 November 2004 at 01:11 PM.]

Many of us have spent decades trying to learn and better understand this machine.
We've spent thousands of dollars on upgrades,
learning materials, practice sessions, etc., in order to pursue our desire to master this steel guitar thing. No one said it was going to be easy. THere are no guarantees.

WHen I learned to play, there were no real steel guitarists in this region. We played in a class environment; twenty or so kids, some well behaved; some not; all in a circle trying to play as a single unit. They called it orchestra practice.

The songs weren't even nursery rhymes (sp?)
but we had to learn to play them. WHY?

There was no steel guitar music even printed, or circulated in quantities; let alone TAB, CD's, video instructional courses or whatever.

Back then, the only musicians that taught steel guitar in Portland were mostly alcoholics and seldom showed up for the lesson. Others were experts in Oboe, triangle, or perhaps harp and taught steel guitar on the side.

WHY, should anyone teaching a valuable course, that has taken them years to master, do it for FREE? Lawyers, dentists, doctors, auto mechanics, surely don't. Look what your paying for gasoline..........

I've had six students last year and each dropped out after about lesson 2 or 3, as they felt they were not progressing as rapidly as they felt they should. Most likely, I'm not a qualified teacher. Most admittedly, did not have time to practice from one week to the next. Most expected to be playing in a band within about 60-90 days.
Most purchased their guitar/amp/bar, picks, without any advise or recommendations of a more knowledgeable musician.

A teacher can TEACH but a student has to have a burning desire to learn; must be committed and have the stamina to practice, practice, practice. Without the students own dedication to bring it all together, no teacher at any price can make it happen.

You mention many students lack the money to pay for a teacher. Do you really believe that we, that have been playing for years, got our instruction for FREE? I think not.

I had to learn from 78 rpm records and a small Webcore record player. No hands on where I was at.

Calvin, I do understand your disappointment but I also believe you're unfairly laying a lot of blame on those of us players that have been at it for years instead of accepting "a failure" at your own feet. This is not meant as a put down but why are we responsible for your decision to drop out. I've been playing sixty one years and still have to dig out things for which I can find no easy source from which to learn it accurately. I've got a 90 minute cassette full of "hot licks" or "runs" that I've heard and desperately want to learn but cannot for the life of me, figure out how to do them. Someday, maybe?

Yes, perhaps you did the right thing by dropping out. Most likely the steel guitar was just not for you......but then again, you just might later learn, that the bug has bitten you quite hard, and you just might find yourself jumping right back in it again.

Lot's of current players have quit playing for years, only to get back into it. This has caused a lot of required, re-learning of all that had been forgotten during the interum.

Here's my take, if you really wanted to play bad enough in the first place you would do nothing but sit behind that steel and figure out what you could. I was 13 years old and took an old 12 string guitar, pulled off the 6 strings, tuned in in an e chord and tried to play along with Charlie Pride records. I did not have anyone show me anything. In fact, I did'nt even know a steel player! As time went on I did meet some life long friends who helped me find my way. I listened to tons of steel recordings and did buy some books and tapes.

You will find if you change you whole approch to learning and be patient with the steel you might just surprise yourself in the end.

When I lived in Nashville I did meet a few steel players with pretty big egos, guess what, just because they could play did mean they got the gig! You pros know what I mean.

Be a nice guy, make friends, and buy another steel and start up again. We need more players at all levels to keep our dreams alive.

Come to Sacramento and I will give you all the free lessons you can stand..

Why?

Because this player is a master, and I wouldn't expect him to
spend an hour on stage playing for less than this.

GOOD teaching is harder than playing your gig.
And I got a TON of stuff from this 2 hour session.

Who was this teacher...
Doug Jernigan, a great teacher, a true master steel player,
and a nice guy.
I will never regret for a minute what Doug charged,
because it was worth ever cent.

I also have a buddy near here with 30 years of steeling,
he helped me out several times on technique and basic issues,
lent me TAB and cassettes,
and he never even thought about charging me a cent. He usually has a cup of coffee and such layed out when I come buy.

Thgere's buddy Crowbear, 4 hours away, and less time under his belt, but a fine player,
with tons of steel info and TAB and practical help he has given me.
Never asked for a cent.

So, yeah there are some who charge,
and 99% of the time you are getting a full time working pro helping you,
and it is pretty focused.
And will continue to pay off for a long time, not a week or so.

And more who are just happy to help a newbie get uo and running.

But ya know... the MAJORITY of what I have accomplished was
from MY hard work and digging and asking questions on this forum. And just woodshedding a LOT.

So if you threw in the towel... c'est la vie,
maybe you just weren't meant to be a steeler.
So people don't have the ear intonation for it.
Some don't have the burninf drive to do it.

I may not, but I keep kickin at it, and it gets better.
I also have gotten gigs and calls back, so something is working.

I liken it to being a violin player. After 15 years they say your now a qualified beginner, time to learn to play.

So I am not worried that in 1.5 years I am not chording like Big E, or pick blocking like Joe Wright.
30 years of dobro is definitly not PSG time, though ir did help initially.
I will eventualy get to my level wherever that maybe.

A long roow to hoe, but you do get to the end and turn around eventually.
At some point you also get to harvest.

I am sorry it didn't work for you.
c'est la vie, encore.

[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 02 November 2004 at 11:57 PM.]

dg

A lot of the licks, riffs, harmonies, arpeggios etc I can play came from singing a lick or playing it on reg guitar and finding it on the steel. The idea is to get to where you can play whatever you think up or hear. There's no real "point of arrival", you just keep trying to get better at it. I have a lot of help doing this - all from the best darn teacher in the whole world - a fella by the name of Rick Alexander ! That dude has spent countless hours going over and over stuff with me, helping me work out out and execute increasingly difficult passages, and helping me to understand the theory involved etc. etc. etc. In fact, I can state unequivocally that I owe most everything I achieve to Rick Alexander.

Okay, okay - and Herb and Cindy and Jerry and Bobby and Dewitt, and even Arlen . . . .

I don't give lessons per se, but if a bro steeler asked me nicely I would gladly show and tell what I know. Stop by - and for starters, I'll teach you how to play SLEEPWALK

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Rick Alexander
57 Fender Stringmaster T8, 57 Fender Champ, 59 Valco D8, 47 National New Yorker . .

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Steel players do it without fretting

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http://www.waikiki-islanders.com

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Boy, there's not much to add to you'all's comments. I'm only in my 50's now and been working on this PSG jones since my teens. Almost gettin' sorta good at it

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If it's in his blood Calvin will be back. He's just goin' thru a phase...

[This message was edited by Ray Minich on 02 November 2004 at 07:42 AM.]

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Livin' in the Past and Future with a 12 string Mooney Universal tuning.

Now, if you want to pay me $30-$50 an hour, a monetary value of my time makes up for the intrusion on the rest of my life.

I would assume many others have the same opinion. And then there are those who are willing to help you in anyway imaginable and have run into many on this forum in the short time I've been here. Those are special people and you can't expect them to be around every corner you travel.

What do you do for a living ? Is your time more important and valuable than someone who plays music for a living ?

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Bob
intonation help

A person's expectations, his perception of himself as a player, can make or break you. For me, I just accept that I will only be average, at best, and try to get as much enjoyment out of it as possible.

I wonder if you have used any of Jeff Newman's instructional material. I think Jeff's true genius was that he figured out the basic knowledge that one needed to begin to play music. In other words, if you have spent all your time trying to learn to play Steel Guitar Rag, or Mansion on the Hill, or some other songs, without learning your guitar, something about music and the part that steel guitar plays in a band, it will be almost impossible to make progress. Sadly, a lot of instructional material just gives you some tab and a recorded track and it's up to you to either learn it or not.

Sometimes someone will say:
"You can either play or you can't."
No one is born with a steel guitar in their hands, some do have more talent, though. Those of us who don't, need to accept our limitations and find a way to develop to our highest potential. It's not easy, but it can be fun. Good luck to you, I hope you will give it another try.

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if you have to pay someone to help you on the steel then that person doesn't deserve to sit behind one

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But I can understand that there are fellow steelers that charge a buck or two for lessons.
Playing the steel guitar costs money.Not much but it costs money.Every steeler has dreams about another amp or steel guitar.Teaching somebody how to play steel guitar can help them to make that dream come true.....
But 50 bucks is a bit much I think.
But to call people that charge money for such lessons SNOB's is a bit premature.

Ron

Nikaro SD10 4x6

[This message was edited by Ronald Steenwijk on 02 November 2004 at 09:01 AM.]

You're right! But, just look at the response you've generated. There are a lot of people on this forum here, myself included, that would be willing to sit down with you and show you some stuff. Which is all I ever did got too. Now if you're talking a once-a-week thing, then yes..., most teachers want to get paid for their time. Thats because teaching is all they do for a living, and need to get paid to survive. It looks like you've already made the decision to quit though.., so all I have left to say is: Good luck in all your musical endevors, and I hope you find the instrument of your desires to satisfy your quench for music!

I've always worked hard at improving - the more I learn, the more I realise just how far I have to go; in my case, though, it's never really felt like work.

Calvin: you need an attitude-adjustment if you're going to make headway with ANY instrument. Don't expect all the work to be done for you - a lot of us (me included) starting playing steel long before any learning-materials existed.

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as for the comments about not enough dedication to the steel - if you have dedicated your entire life to a musical instument you have big problem

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There's your problem right there Calvin. Back in debating class we called that a false or incorrect major premise. Start with a false major premise as you have, and any conclusion you reach will surely be erroneous.

The fact is, if you want to have any hope of becoming a steeler you have to put steel first, ergo "dedicate your life" to it. Not to say you have too overlook other things, it just needs to be your primary focus. And you can't give up. That's not even an opinion, it's just the nature of the beast.

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D.S. Rigsby
Carter Starter and various six string toys