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Author
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Topic: Fender Twin Reverb: How are they for Steel Guitar
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Nick Reed
Member From: Springfield, TN
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posted 09 December 2002 09:44 PM
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I'm seriously considering a new Fender Twin Reverb Amp to use with my Steel. The new '65 re-issue model looks just like the old original. Boy do I think I want one bad. For the last several years I've used a Peavey Nashville 400 & now a Nashville 1000.
Just wonder if anyone has used the "TWIN REVERB's" for Steel. If so, how are they. Do they have that ballsy bottom end needed for C6th and the bite needed for E9th. Also, is anyone else using a Twin now for Steel Guitar. If you've used one, how do you like it? Nick[This message was edited by Nick Reed on 09 December 2002 at 09:50 PM.] |
David Biagini
Member From: San Jose, CA, USA
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posted 09 December 2002 10:20 PM
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Calling Ricky Davis... |
Johan Jansen
Member From: Europe
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posted 10 December 2002 12:40 AM
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They are great for steel, especially on low volumes and if the tubes are matched that well that they have a 'sweet spot'. That's about the ammount of clipping, so the tubes start compressing with almost none distortion. It makes your guitar sing.  ------------------
 Click on the pic! |
CrowBear Schmitt
Member From: Ariege, - PairO'knees, - France
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posted 10 December 2002 12:42 AM
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i use a Twin w: jbl K120s which cuts it on E9
but i don't like it as much on C6
i would like to try a Nash 1000------------------
Steel what? |
Donny Hinson
Member From: Balto., Md. U.S.A.
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posted 10 December 2002 01:00 AM
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Nick, I played an old BF T/R for years, and was very happy with the sound, tone, and especially the reverb! While it's physically a little bigger, and doesn't have quite the power of the 400, it will get you by on all but the largest gigs. Like most all amps, you have to run the mids very low to get a full sound, and decent bass response. |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 10 December 2002 01:47 AM
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Yes I use one and have for years......I dig it just fine......and I'll mirror what Donny(sorry Donny for spelling your name wrong>corrected now) said.
I used one of the re-issues on the Dale Watson Live from London CD and you can hear for yourself that it is a nice sound.
But things are about to change for me....so I may not be playing through my twin on a regular basis.....more later....
Ricky[This message was edited by Ricky Davis on 10 December 2002 at 12:47 PM.] |
Bill Crook
Member From: Goodlettsville, TN , Spending my kid's inheritance
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posted 10 December 2002 05:32 AM
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Hey Nick.....You wont like it.
Our 6-string lead player has one and I tried it. Believe me, This isn't an amp for PSG !! Personally, I think that if you replace the "Profex" with a "Profex II" and stay with your "Nashville 1000",you will be far more happy.
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Rick McDuffie
Member From: Smithfield, North Carolina, USA
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posted 10 December 2002 06:26 AM
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I wouldn't think the Twin reissue is going to have the power or the speakers for steel. Unless I'm mistaken, that reissue isn't as powerful as the 70's Twin... and there's a good reason that Fender used to offer those w/ JBL's. |
David Doggett
Member From: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA
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posted 10 December 2002 06:46 AM
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I normally play through a Nashville 400, but sometimes for practices I borrow a Fender twin that's already there. It doesn't have the bass response to sound good with steel in small group situations. In a large group with a lot of bass and drums, a twin might be able to cut through and work okay. But it doesn't have the power you need for that situation. You'll be clipping and hitting the bottom on your volume pedal. Maybe if you mic it that may work for you. There are some people who like that bright cutting sound, and at low volume the tubes sound good. But all these problems are the reasons Peavey and others designed special amps for steel. |
Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 10 December 2002 07:45 AM
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I ordered a new Twin Reverb in the late '60s. But I ordered it with the JBL speakers in it. I think that made the difference for steel playing. But heavy, you bet! 
Erv |
Ernie Renn
Member From: Brainerd, Minnesota USA
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posted 10 December 2002 08:16 AM
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Nick;Buddy used a Twin for the black album, so I know it's in there. Keeping in mind it was in the studio and not 'on stage' volume. I used one for a while and couldn't get both necks to sound right at the same time. You can find a sweet spot for each neck, but there's some knob twisting involved for each setting. ------------------
My best,
Ernie
The Official Buddy Emmons Website
www.buddyemmons.com |
Larry Bell
Member From: Englewood, Florida
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posted 10 December 2002 08:28 AM
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Ah, what goes around comes around.
Ford? GM?
Push/pull? All/pull?
Tubes? Solid state?D-10? Universal?All those decisions are personal choices that help determine, along with musical talent and physical ability, what a steel player sounds like. I LOVE THE DIVERSITY. We players gotta lose the 'this is better' mentality. THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS BETTER -- THERE'S JUST DIFFERENT. Better/worse is in your own perception and it reflects your personal taste (or lack thereof  ) Do tube amps sound great?
yep -- the great ones do
Do solid state amps sound great?
sure -- SOME of them do The new Twin is a great steel amp, within its limitations. I just played through one last week and I love it. I would never haul it around, though. My solid state Standel or my late 70s Session 400 sound better to my ears at gig volume than the Twin. BUT, you're never gonna get that tube compression and warm fuzzies through a transistor amp (at least, none that I've found -- altho my 1970 Standel is close). Again -- PERSONAL PREFERENCE. Nobody can answer the question for you. Try one out ON A GIG (not just in your practice room -- that can fool you big time) ------------------
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro |
Brad Sarno
Member From: St. Louis, MO USA
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posted 10 December 2002 09:43 AM
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How can ANYONE say the Twin isn't a good steel amp? That's insane. Many of the holy grail recordings of steel were on Twins. Listen to the years of Lloyd Green on a Twin, Tom Brumley, Buddy Emmons' Black album, and the list goes on. It's so funny how hard people try to get these classic sounds but they insist on using their modern solid state amps to do it. Brad Sarno
'66, '69 Emmons p/p, '69 Twin
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Pete Burak
Member From: Portland, OR USA
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posted 10 December 2002 09:46 AM
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I've found that Fender tube amps make harmonics sound really great and seemingly effortless to pop and sustain. |
Michael Johnstone
Member From: Sylmar,Ca. USA
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posted 10 December 2002 10:15 AM
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I've played thru a Twin recently and it ended up sounding acceptable but not with its stock 12" lectric geetar speakers which are real mushy.When I hooked it up to a Black Widow 15" I realized that the amp was cleaner than I thought.The other problem with Twins is the lack of dramatic EQ control - especially in the mids.When I patched in an old MXR 10 band graphic EQ I happened to have,I was able to shape the mids within reason.All that and a Nanoverb gave me a respectable steel sound at a giggable voulme.If somebody was to build a 300 watt compact tube amp with a parametric EQ,a stout 15" speaker and a built in digital reverb I think they could sell a bunch of them. -MJ- |
Bob Hoffnar
Member From: Brooklyn, NY
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posted 10 December 2002 10:19 AM
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I personally don't like to use twins. There is a dip in the mids that does not work for me.Bob |
Larry Bell
Member From: Englewood, Florida
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posted 10 December 2002 11:12 AM
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The reason I don't use a Twin is that, FOR ME, the signal gets transparent at too low a volume. What I mean by that is, you turn the volume from 4 to 5 and it isn't much louder -- you go up to 6 and it still doesn't have the punch that a solid state steel amp has.You can clearly see this by listening to a band where both a Tele player and a steel player play thru a Twin. Steel player will be buried in no time. I also agree with Bob that the Twin is far from the best tube amp for steel. Most of those that are better fall into the 'boutique' category, however. I'll stick with my old solid state Standel. Several musicians who have heard it were surprised it wasn't a tube amp. If I need higher volume, I'll go with a rack system with a tube preamp and a Mos/Fet power amp like the TubeWorks stuff. The harmonics and 'warm fuzzies' from a Twin are wonderful, but I can't afford to carry around two Twins and that's what I'd need to be able to cover all styles and venues. Just my opinion.[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 10 December 2002 at 11:18 AM.] |
Rick McDuffie
Member From: Smithfield, North Carolina, USA
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posted 10 December 2002 11:14 AM
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Just checked the power rating on the Twin reissue- 85 watts at 4 ohms. I'm a Fender AND Peavey dealer, so no vested interest here. I'd only say that steel is going to sound a lot better through JBL's than through Jensens. The Twin was widely used in the 60's because it was the biggest, baddest, most powerful thing available in its day. But... as you know, things DO change : ) |
Dave Van Allen
Member From: Doylestown, PA , US , Earth
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posted 10 December 2002 03:57 PM
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quote:
You can clearly see this by listening to a band where both a Tele player and a steel player play thru a Twin. Steel player will be buried in no time.
Larry, although I agree in actuality, I still feel this statementis an invalid comparison, however true it may be. we're using volume pedals, and are using a greater dynamic range and the upper part of the pedal throw for sustain, not sheer volume. The twin will indeed not compete for sheer volume with a tele blasting thru the same type amp. I know, I play with a guy who does this to me with his tele . I lose every time... but I can Mic it if I have to besides, tele's go to 11. |
Brad Sarno
Member From: St. Louis, MO USA
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posted 10 December 2002 07:10 PM
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I agree with Bob that the mid eq control on a twin is in the wrong place. That's why I changed the slope resistor in the tone section so that the mid control is now up around 750-800Hz. That's where most people seem to like to cut a little bit. I tell you, with the twin set up this way, it's perfect. Honestly though, sometimes it just aint enough power so that's where the ss amps come in. But for sheer tone, !@!#$%.Brad Sarno |
tom anderson
Member From: leawood, ks., usa
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posted 10 December 2002 09:59 PM
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I have had a shobud amp, solid state, very clean, but not much volume, a crate vintage tube amp (kind of dirty), and finally a reissue fender twin. I love the twin. It has twice the reverb of the crate, and can sound clean like the shobud but with way more volume. When I play in clubs, I can't turn it up past 3 or my guitar player gets on me for being too loud. Both the guitar player & the bass player love the tone I get through the amp & how different it is from the telecaster. It has tons of bass & growl if I want to go there in a song. I decided on this amp when I took my crate into the music store & played both side by side. There was no question that the fender sounded better to me. When I was looking, I also tried a fender quadroverb or vibroverb (the tall square one) that was used, and I didn't think it sounded any better, though lots of guys swear by that amp, plus it was used and almost the same money. Just take your amp & compare. |
Mike Perlowin
Member From: Los Angeles CA
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posted 10 December 2002 11:08 PM
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This is another of those "what's better, red or blue" questions. There is no right answer. It's all subjective. You need to try out the amp for yourself and see whether or not you like what you hear. If you do, then it's the right amp for you. Other people's opinions don't matter. |
LARRY COLE
Member From: COLUMBUS, OHIO, USA
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posted 11 December 2002 03:07 AM
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Everyone knows red is better.------------------
LC. WILLIAMS U12, SHO-BUD PRO1,CARVIN TL60
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Bill Ford
Member From: Graniteville SC Aiken
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posted 11 December 2002 06:26 AM
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Red>>>------------------
Bill Ford |
Brad Burch
Member From: Athens, Ga USA
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posted 11 December 2002 11:09 AM
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Remind me not to go see your band if a Twin doesn't have enough power for you to be heard...... |
Emmett Roch
Member From: Dripping Springs, Texas
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posted 11 December 2002 06:31 PM
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Twice in my life---first was a silver-face, the next was a Twin II---I've replaced the baffle boards in Twins and installed a 15" speaker, and loved the results. As far as what Larry said about adjusting the tone for each neck, I play a single-neck guitar and don't have that to contend with, so if you play a double, I'd say listen to him on this. And I'd like to concur that Ricky has always gotten a great tone for both necks using a Twin. |
Larry Bell
Member From: Englewood, Florida
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posted 12 December 2002 10:04 AM
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quote:
As far as what Larry said about adjusting the tone for each neck
Nobody's ever accused me of being a double-neck player. Them's fightin' words . . .
 Ernie made that comment, just for clarification ------------------
Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 12 December 2002 at 10:05 AM.] |
Ernie Renn
Member From: Brainerd, Minnesota USA
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posted 12 December 2002 10:33 AM
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I did say that. When I was using the amp, I couldn't find a setting that would sound right to me on both necks. Hence adjusting tone for each neck. (BTW: It had a 15" JBL in it.) I switched to a Peavey Session 400 in '77 and really haven't looked back. I've had Peavey amps ever since.------------------
My best,
Ernie
The Official Buddy Emmons Website
www.buddyemmons.com |
ajm
Member From: Los Angeles
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posted 12 December 2002 06:52 PM
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If the Tele player is too loud then he's not playing WITH you, he's playing AGAINST you.There are several solutions:
1) He can use an overdrive pedal for a little more "mild" dirt if that's what he's after.
2) He can use a power attenuator to turn the amp up but keep the volume down (THD Hotplate, etc.)
3) He can get a smaller amp such as a Deluxe Reverb. Chances are he probably has one of more of these already. We have the technology........
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Artie McEwan
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Peter de Smet
Member From: The Netherlands
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posted 13 December 2002 03:40 AM
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I do a lot of gigs on my Kendrick amp. This amp is a replica of the first Fender Twin amp. In compare with Fender Twin, this amp has Kendrick Speakers (2x 12")with trombone cone. And that sounds much better than the Fender.Very deep an tight bottom, sweets highs and a very good midtone. And that's the reason that i don't play on a Fender twin.
Good luck. |
SKIP MERTZ
Member From: N.C
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posted 13 December 2002 05:33 AM
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Try an Evans. Tube warmth and you won't throw your back out. I use 2 SE150s' 38lbs ea. 300 rms, an RV-3 which has a stereo out
which I run to second amp, awesome. Thet're not cheap but neither are our steels Skip |
Emmett Roch
Member From: Dripping Springs, Texas
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posted 13 December 2002 05:58 AM
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Whoops! Sorry Larry ------------------
___________________
GFI S-12 extended E9
www.garypnunn.com
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Roy Ayres
Member From: Starke, Florida, USA
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posted 13 December 2002 06:08 AM
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I have an original "black-face" Twin Reverb with 12" JBL's. I suppose it's all a matter of taste, but this one has suited my taste for about 40 years. My wife had it "tweaked up" for me last week for my birthday (pots cleaned, a few resistors replaced, etc.) and it still sounds the way I like my steel to sound. I have been offered some tremendous trades over the years, but turned them all down. |
Tim Sergent
Member From: Hendersonville, TN, USA
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posted 13 December 2002 07:18 PM
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I used two Twins when I was with Ricky Skaggs and I loved them! At times it was kinda hard to keep up in volume with 8 or 9 other guys, but the tone I got was right for me....but like Mike said, it's gotta be right for you! A lot of guys are talking about the Fender Hot Rod Deville. I think that's the model. I hear Lloyd is even using one. That's a pretty good endorsement right there! |
JB Arnold
Member From: Longmont,Co,USA
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posted 15 December 2002 09:38 PM
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The twin is a great amp for steel, but I'm taking Cage's advice and having the caps replaced, the tone circuits reworked (some work on the mids) matched tubes and some changes in the grids to boost them up. That will all run about 50 or 60 bucks. Once I've got THAT right, I'll take BC's next advice-remove the factory speaker, and stoer ir somewhere safe, like the trash. I'll round up a couple JBL's in a separate cab (maybe even a hard trucker if I get lucky) and carry that separate.Butch tells me just the electronics will make a big difference-and the JBL's will do the rest. I already love the sound, so I'm really looking forward to the new year gig, when I'll be testing it out in a big room.
JB
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Fulawka D-10 9&5
Mullen Royal Precision D-10 8 & 5
"All in all, looking back, I'd have to say the best advice anyone ever gave me was 'Hands Up, Don't Move!"
www.johnbarnold.com/pedalsteel
www.buddycage.net http://www.nrpsmusic.com/index.html
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Smiley Roberts
Member From: Hendersonville,Tn. 37075
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posted 15 December 2002 10:24 PM
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Amplifiers are kinda like what they say about computers,i.e. "s__t in,.....s__t out". ------------------
~ ~
©¿© It don't mean a thang,
mm if it ain't got that twang.
www.ntsga.com |
Ernie Renn
Member From: Brainerd, Minnesota USA
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posted 16 December 2002 02:43 AM
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Smiley;
"SENT"?------------------
My best,
Ernie
The Official Buddy Emmons Website
www.buddyemmons.com |
Bob Hamilton
Member From: Atascadero, California, USA
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posted 16 December 2002 07:56 AM
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I use a '69 Twin for small gigs, can't beat the tone, especially with the slope resistor changed from 100K to 56K. BTW, there's a great tone stack calculator on the Duncan Amps website that will allow you to dial in the midrange cut before you dig out the old soldering gun, it's a great tool. For the bigger stuff, I use my Session 500 (three cord arrangement) and run stereo out to the Twin thru a Boss RV-3, and the six string goes thru the Twin's vibrato channel. With the Twin and the Session, it's really the best of both worlds.------------------
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Dave Birkett
Member From: Oxnard, CA, USA
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posted 16 December 2002 11:41 AM
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quote:
If somebody was to build a 300 watt compact tube amp with a parametric EQ
That would be great. Fender does make a 300 watt tube amp with a graphic EQ, the Bassman 300. It's only a head but weighs in at 75 lbs. It also lists for $1700! For most of my bass-playing career, I used a Dual Showman, often two of them, and sometimes three. They beat all the solid-state amps for tone hands down. The head was the same as a Twin w/o reverb (and a lot lighter). I think the optimal solution would be as many Dual Showman tops and 1X15 JBL-loaded cabs as the gig required, along with an EQ and a delay/rev unit. |
Dave Van Allen
Member From: Doylestown, PA , US , Earth
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posted 17 December 2002 06:53 AM
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quote:
I think the optimal solution would be as many Dual Showman tops and 1X15 JBL-loaded cabs as the gig required, along with an EQ and a delay/rev unit.
I like the way you think... |
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