quote:

---

Years ago I met a fellow modeler who hoards locomotives - he has a huge stash and leaves most of them to sit in their boxes. He has no layout, so they will never see any action. To me, that is just plain greed, and I hope he loses sleep wondering what's going to happen to his hoard after he dies.

---

quote:

---

why not create a special section with the names and photos of members playing their guitars?

---

Someone on this thread has justified his accumulation of model locomotives by saying that he actually runs them, while another correspondant speaks of playing all the guitars that he has. No justification, however, is required - we can do whatever we want with our 'stuff'!

We're in the process of moving 'house', and I've just re-discovered a Telecaster I forgot that I owned! Curious as it may seem to some contributors to this topic, I feel no compunction to make a gift of this to anybody - however 'deserving' they may be; if there's someone out there consumed with a real passion to play an instrument, then that passion will drive them to acquire what they need.

My engines ('3rd Rail Brass' or MTH 'Premier' in my case, Jeff) simply sit on shelves - there's real joy in their aesthetics alone, and I have guitars that haven't seen the light of day for months ('though they will when their turn comes). I don't sit and calculate the value of these items, but the pleasure I've derived from them is inestimable.

I think that this 'thread' was started in fairly light-hearted vein, but its tone has become a little 'dark' (you'll have to pry my 'Union Pacific Big-Boy' from my cold, dead fingers!!!)

I wish I had Herb's steel collection - AND that Martin 000-21!!!!!

He Covets..

What a completely asinine train of thought, Mike.

Just because someone is a real party animal doesn't entitle them to a bargain price on the Playboy Mansion.

Gosh!

------------------
HagFan

Hope you get your perscription refilled soon.

------------------
HagFan

PS: 86-posts, 3-pages nd counting... That will be tough to beat.

[This message was edited by Ron Page on 04 February 2003 at 11:41 AM.]

That "F" word makes me smile.

I sure would like to see a few of those
FENDERS.

[This message was edited by Jody Carver on 04 February 2003 at 01:59 PM.]

Guitars are a lot like women.

You see, when you're young, you want to "own" just about every new and different one you come across. Then, as you get older, you realize that you'd probably have been happier if you could have just found that "right" one first!

I have not been working as dilligently on my book as of late,I have been sidetracked by personal health issues with my wife.

I'm going to make an attempt to get the book
into high gear as soon as I possibly can.

I myself get enjoyment from the memories as
I re-live them as I write of a time long gone

Being a Fender enthusiast as you are,I think
you will enjoy my stories of a time no longer.

I'm impressed with your collection and I look
up to someone like yourself who has the courage to disclose what you are proud to own
I know I would.

Thanks again for your nice words,I appreciate
them. I will make everyone aware of the introduction of my book. I will post it when
its ready to hatch.

Jody.. edited to think of all those Fenders you have,you certainly are proud and a lucky
guy to have them.and that goes both ways,they
are lucky to have a home like you gave them.

Good Luck.

[This message was edited by Jody Carver on 04 February 2003 at 09:55 PM.]

quote:

---

An overwelming victory for me and I appreciate the support

---

Congradulations. I propose we throw a victory party for Don, but first, we'll have to take up a collection

[This message was edited by HowardR on 05 February 2003 at 05:17 AM.]

In Japan, it has become fashionable among some very wealthy people to collect as many vintage instruments as possible. I don't mean people owning dozen of guitars, but rather hundreds, sometimes thousands of irreplaceable vintage treasures. I've heard on one banjo collection with over 5,000 pieces, including hundreds of Pre WW2 Gibson Mastertones, Vega Whyte Laydies (I think that's the way they were spelled when they were being manufactured) and Tubaphones.

These precious instruments are being lost to the world's musicians forever, and people like us, for whom these are tools with which we create our art are being denied the use of them.

A side effect of this hoarding is that the prices of the few remaining vintage instruments as been artificially jacked up to the point where they are absolutely beyond the reach of most musicians. I've seen pre-CBS strats selling for $12 to 15,000, and 50's vintage Les Pauls going for over $20 grand. One of our fellow forumites has a 1959 Gretsch White Falcon that he bought new in 1959, for which he was offered $80,000.

This is not my opinion, this is fact.

My [u]opinion[/u] is that this sucks. My emotional reaction to this is that I resent the fact that if I find an old guitar I love, I will not have the opportunity to buy it at a price commensurate with it's value to me as a working tool. And I defy anybody who sees a beautiful guitar that they would like to own, only to find that it costs over $20,000 due to this unfortunate situation, to feel differently.

I have no problem whatsoever with guys like Herb and Paul Warnick and Mike Weirich and Gary Morrisson having collections of steels for their personal use, and I hope none of you guys think I was attacking you personally.

Oh and BTW, before this situation developed, there were plenty of guitar companies making instruments. The availability of vintage guitars at reasonable prices did not put anybody out of business. To suggest that if they were still available at these prices, this would somehow would prevent the manufacture of new guitars is totally absurd.

Everyone of them would be another memory for me. I understand your point,but there are people who enjoy collecting,whether they play
them or not.Its a hobby I guess.

But if anyone wants a 1962 Gibson Medoly Maker (ser# 46257), I'll glady let mine go for... Hmm... $120,000 US. Good condition with original case. Is this Ebay.com?

I don't "hoard" this guitar. It some how is my first choice for rock'n'roll leads when recording.

Aside to Jody: I have a Fender bass fenatic friend (age ~58) who is trying to date an early bass he has (he is the original owner). Ser#64. It looks like a tele bass, but he swears it's an early p-pass. Any clues? The current Fender site couldn't date it. Email me?

(...Let 'em go before you die... But wait until the very end?)

JMHO.

------------------
SUAS U' PHIOB
Geo

quote:

---

A side effect of this hoarding is that the prices of the few remaining vintage instruments as been artificially jacked up

---

The reason the instruments are collected/hoarded is because they already were going up substantially in price, and the wealthy collectors jumped in. It's the MUSICIANS who initially drove the price up by willingly paying more (understandably) for certain instruments, and it's the musicians who apparently didn't share your views about how important it was to keep these instruments circulating, so they WILLINGLY kept selling them for more and more money. The wealthy jump in ONLY after the collectible has increased in value, and only when there are people willing to sell the collectible (which then drives the prices further up). If you are going to take a position on this subject, then you need to understand these dynamcics (even if you don't like them). The musicians caused all this to happen. The wealthy collectors are just looking for somtething to buy, and the musicians are happy to oblige at higher and higher prices. Not politically correct, but these are the facts.

[This message was edited by Jeff Lampert on 06 February 2003 at 08:10 AM.]

------------------
Steeling is still legal in Arizona

quote:

---

The availability of vintage guitars at reasonable prices did not put anybody out of business. To suggest that if they were still available at these prices, this would somehow would prevent the manufacture of new guitars is totally absurd.

I can't even begin to guess at the logic behind such a ridiculous assertion.

---

quote:

---

In a socialist or communist society there is no motiviation to be innovative and produce quality products.

---

Socialism....everybody works in factories owned by the "people" producing vintage guitars for the people. Nobody can afford one. "Power to the Pick Up."

Capitalism....everybody can own whatever vintage guitar they want and can afford. Nobody is happy with what thay have, only with what other people have.

Voyeurism....looking at other people's vintage guitars is more desirable than actually owning them.

Antagonism....this thread

[This message was edited by HowardR on 06 February 2003 at 09:08 PM.]

(It's great that this is a truly international forum. I'll try harder not to state things as if the U.S. is the center of the universe.)

------------------
HagFan

quote:

---

I've heard on one banjo collection with over 5,000 pieces...

---

quote:

---

What a wonderful service that collector is performing, taking all of those banjos out of circulation! (Unless it's one banjo broken into 5,000 pieces, which would be okay, too. )

---

Gotta go with you on that one b0b Wanna buy my Emmons?
Ray www.swsteelguitar.com

------------------
Steeling is still legal in Arizona

quote:

---

I also understood you to be advocating a system whereby collectors' stashes of instruments should be made available to musicians who "need" them.

---

I never said that Chris, and I don't know where you got the idea that I did. All I said was that I don't like the fact that many of these instruments are going to people who don't play them, and their prices have been artificially jacked up to the point where they are unobtainable.

Fortunately, guitar manufacturers have the technology to make replicas of those vintage masterpieces and sell them for a fraction of the cost of the originals. For me, a Korean made Epiphone Les Paul Standard or Mexican made Fender Stratocaster would suffice. I don't need the exact same type of guitar to want to play like my heroes.

quote:

---

…I object to non-musicians who are buying up all the vintage Fenders and Gibsons and other great guitars to put in display cases, and driving up the prices to the point where working musicians can't afford them.

---

quote:

---

… But I do have a problem with collectors who don't play themselves who are buying up and hoarding irreplacable vintage instruments and keeping them out of the hands of the people like us for whom they were intended.

---

quote:

---

… There are lots of decent affordable instruments floating around. Enough so that nobody who wants one need be deprived, but only a finite number of choice vintage pieces, and I say these should be in the hands of people who play them, or at least available at reasonable prices.

---

quote:

---

… I am talking about those collectors WHO DON'T PLAY, who are grabbing up vintage Fenders and Gibsons and Martin acoustics to use as some sort of trophies, who are driving the prices up and preventing people like us from obtaining them.

---

Chris’ summary seems pretty much right on.

Perhaps we misunderstood.

Mike, I’m just jerking your chain on this. Perhaps we’ll experience an analogy to the tech bubble in vintage guitars. In the mean time you're guilty of a certain amount of wishful thinking.

------------------
HagFan

[This message was edited by Ron Page on 06 February 2003 at 05:43 PM.]