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This topic was originally posted in this forum: Pedal Steel
Author Topic:   Dreams can become reality
BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 03 September 2001 10:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
Sage------ Yes, Yes, and Me too!
I've got 3800 hours, am I 'sposed to have a licence? (just kidding,FAA)
Bobbe


Pat Burns
Member

Posts: 2896
From: Branchville, N.J. USA
Registered: JAN 99

posted 03 September 2001 02:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Pat Burns     
...Bobbe, you've invented an automatic finger-puller?...



Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 03 September 2001 05:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

I mentioned undue leverage, back in the thread, as a contributing factor. This occurs where the string passes over the apex of the changer. The combination of the cross-shaft, and the finger pull connection, creates a stress area that further diminishes the longevity of the .011 string. Hence, the lucky 7, with its minimal 3/32 pitch tends to avoid developing pitch leverage, and disallows the string to be placed under undue leverage stress. Introducing friction free ball bearings in combination with a third finger roller, together with the lucky 7 is in the design changes for the near future. The lucky 7 features the least amount of pitch, in relation to the changer of any attachment, or modification described in this thread to date. The design lends itself to the least amount of destructive movement.

The 3rd string changer will require space-age sensitivity, whereby, the slightest pressure will create a rotating movement to further compensate for the undue leverage. Eliminating the wound portion of the string, is a must, and the use of a tiny ball at the end of the string would contribute to its durability, by reducing "memory" of the excessive twisting and winding in the manufacturing process. Durability would be readily improved if the steel guitarist uses restraint while tuning the .011 string to proper pitch. Tuning the string flat, and dancing on the B pedal several times, will allow the spring wire to ameliorate to the sudden demands placed upon it to tighten and relax. There is a subtle connection in regard to string life and proper handling of the string. Bill H.

[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 04 September 2001 at 06:34 AM.]



Al Udeen
Member

Posts: 1164
From: maple grove mn usa
Registered: AUG 99

posted 03 September 2001 07:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Udeen     
Bobbie! That kid lives a lot closer to you than he does to me! the last time I saw him was Sat on the Opry! Keep sellin those strings by the hunert, so you can retire while your still young! Cya Al


BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 03 September 2001 07:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
Here is my response to the last three posts.
Huh? yea, and OK,whatever you say.(not nesessarally in that order). OK guys ,the test is going on as we speak and already we have learned some intresting stuff that may cause some pretty strong feelings to come into play on this subject.
Bobbe


Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 03 September 2001 11:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Hi Al Udeen,

I was at the music store on Fenn St. in
Pittsfield, Ma. in the mid-seventies,
when you were demonstrating Sho-Bud
guitars, during the corporation change
period. I think you played a Lloyd
Green model. I also heard your rendition of "JONESY". The show was
video-taped. Bill H.

[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 03 September 2001 at 11:39 PM.]



Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 04 September 2001 04:01 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Bobbe Seymour,

Praises would rain down on you
interminibly, if you entered into
string testing, and mechanical design
changes, by shifting your great
musical artistry, and applying the
powerful influences in the direction
of a resolve of random string breakage.
Bill H.


Johan Jansen
Member

Posts: 2207
From: Europe
Registered:

posted 04 September 2001 08:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johan Jansen     
Bob, when are you going to transport this thread to the humor-topics? JJ


Al Udeen
Member

Posts: 1164
From: maple grove mn usa
Registered: AUG 99

posted 04 September 2001 05:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Udeen     
Since when is string breakage funny?


Ed Miller Jr
Member

Posts: 102
From: Coldwater,Mi USA
Registered: FEB 2001

posted 04 September 2001 05:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ed Miller Jr     
Gene, When I was at the Rock&Roll HOF a couple of years ago Carl's Coat hanger- equipped ES-5 switchmaster was hanging there.So was the grocery sack that he wrote blue suede shoes on. It looked like a crude string bender. I must admit;Gene Parsons came up with a much better arrangement.
By the way Bill,way back on page one you said that you would try to post pictures of this critter, When can we expect delivery?

ED

Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 04 September 2001 06:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Ed M. Jr.

I'll pick up some new film tomorrow. If you e-mail me your address, I will mail you some photos from different angles of the "LUCKY 7", within a week. Bill H.

Steve Feldman
Member

Posts: 2983
From: Millbury, MA USA
Registered: DEC 99

posted 04 September 2001 06:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Steve Feldman     
Hells Bells, Bill! Why don't you just e-mail me some pictures of this contraption and I'll host 'em and post 'em for all to see. That way, we can truly find out if a picture is worth 10,000,000,000,000,000 words.

[This message was edited by Steve Feldman on 04 September 2001 at 06:58 PM.]



Moon in Alaska
Member

Posts: 1155
From: Kasilof, Alaska **** way up NORTH TO ALASKA
Registered: DEC 99

posted 05 September 2001 12:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moon in Alaska     
I wanted to add something smart to this WORLD RECORD thread, but just did not have a good enough vocabulary !!!

------------------
<< Moon Mullin in Alaska >>
==Carter S-10==
<< Old Fender-400 >>
== Evans FET 500 Custom LV ==

CLICK HERE FOR MOON'S NEW WEB SITE



Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 05 September 2001 03:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Moon in Alaska,

By the same token, I have always
thought, since first reading your posts,
that there is a man whom I do not know,
nor have I ever had the pleasure of
meeting. Chance meetings have taken
place at Massachusetts' Steel Guitar
Bashes, which have been held since 1981.
Many times steel guitarists have visited friends in the surrounding area, and have attended The steel guitar BASH.

I once read a good book, which was in
our library in Pittsfield, Ma. It was
written by a person who sought to
expressly give accounts of steel guitar
information, that would otherwise not
be known. I would be delighted to
hear more of one particular situation
that had taken place in Alaska. The
writer had stated that a steel guitarist
after 6 years on the road, suddenly
gave up playing, and moved to Alaska to
" pan for gold." " He buried his steel
guitar 6' deep, and placed a tombstone
above it, reading, 'Here lies the heart
of (........).' Have you ever heard
anything mentioned in Alaska, that
would allude to this man ? As you can
see, I have excluded the person's name
because my recall has failed to allow
a remembrance of it. This touching
event took place years ago. It would be
of great interest to know more about
his life in the years that followed the
heartbreaking event. Thank you for
your reply, and there is no doubt in my
mind, that we could have a fireside
chat over hot coffee and donuts, which
might cover many aspects of the 3rd
string's tendencies to provide many
unwelcome surprises. Bill Hankey


[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 05 September 2001 at 03:09 AM.]

[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 05 September 2001 at 05:29 AM.]



Paul Graupp
Member

Posts: 3199
From: Macon Ga USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 05 September 2001 05:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Graupp     
Bill; I don't suppose you'd care to recall the title of that book or the author, would you ? I'm thinking there may be a lot of other things that would interest folks like us in that volume. I read somewhere on the Forum that Bobby Koefer buried his Fender Triple neck and since he's playing again, last I heard was with AATW, I was wondering as well about the condition it was in when he got it back from MN. I also read that he didn't use all eight strings so my conclusion would be that if he didn't use the third string either, he might add to this conversation as well.

On my Carter D-12, on the 6th tuning neck, my first string is an A 10ga and it has never broken. I change every 6-8 weeks if I'm working. Use them Cobalt-Brass strings that Bobbe sells and they work very acceptably. On the other neck, E9th I use an 11ga for a third string and the only one that ever broke before I changed it was when some other fellow was setting in for me. If they ever start to break I will look into your solution for assistance.

Regards, Paul

Jeff Lampert
Member

Posts: 2636
From: queens, new york city
Registered: MAY 2000

posted 05 September 2001 07:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jeff Lampert     
Burp.


Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 05 September 2001 08:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Hi Paul G.,

I appreciate the time you have given in
responding to this thread. It surely
had to be back during the eighties,
when I located the book, that provided
much information about the players of
the steel guitars, and unusual accounts,
which further held my interest. The
best approach that I can make in trying
to locate the author, would be, to go
back to the library, and try to assign
a librarian to assist me. Past requests
have produced surprising results on
other searches.

The author did not stress the maker in
his account. Alaska was its resting
place. This may differ from Bobby K's
preference of burial location, and his
departure from his usual inseparable
great joy of owning, and playing the
triple neck Fender steel guitar.

Paul, I explained earlier, that test
comparisons are only made on E9th
chromatic tunings, with the typical 10
string setup. The C6th or twelve string
extended E9th guitar tunings differ to
some degree. The C6th strings are much
less prone to breakages, due to size
and pitch. The 12 string extended 9th
offers a slight "buffer zone" which may,
or may not prevent the player from
picking with excessive force. It's just
natural that the player of a 12 string
would rake the 3rd fewer times during
a set, than a player of a 10 string. If
someone built a 25 string guitar, there
is every reason to believe that the
fragile .011 would reach a normal life
span. As the saying goes, when he is
picking on someone else, he's not
picking on me. Bill H.



Ed Naylor
Member

Posts: 1827
From: portsmouth.ohio usa
Registered:

posted 05 September 2001 04:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ed Naylor     
Several years ago I wrote the "Steel Guitarist Prayer" The last 2 line were"Lord I ask as my final plea, That I don't break string #3".Anyone ever think about that??? Ed Naylor Steel Guitar Works


slick
Member

Posts: 560
From: Calhoun Georgia
Registered: DEC 99

posted 05 September 2001 05:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for slick     
Im am of the opinion that there will be no pictures.Just trying to get this to 200!!!


Wayne


Paul Graupp
Member

Posts: 3199
From: Macon Ga USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 05 September 2001 05:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Graupp     
When I posted the count was 176. Four others have posted since then and now it's 177 !!
Aww Well; I never could count right. And some on the Forum will say I can't spell either.....chords, that is. But don't worry about that because I have a good teacher and he don't have no ruler either. Thanks Carl Dixon for the time you take to explain my questions. What a guy ! What a friend !!
What a man !!!

Regards, Paul

Jeff Lampert
Member

Posts: 2636
From: queens, new york city
Registered: MAY 2000

posted 05 September 2001 08:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jeff Lampert     
quote:
Thanks Carl Dixon for the time you take to explain my questions. What a guy ! What a friend !!
What a man !!!

Carl is a terrific fellow. As the saying goes, he has forgotten more than most of us will ever know.

BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 05 September 2001 09:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
Yea, I too heard he had a memory problem!
Just remember Carl,Your house is mine.
Ole' Carl has more talent in his whole body, than I have in my little finger! No,I'm not kidding, I really mean it Carl!
I only wish I could have done in a day what you have done in a whole lifetime Carl.
Carl, this is your friend,Bobbe,answer me!
Quit kidding around Carl.My string test is almost done!


Paul Graupp
Member

Posts: 3199
From: Macon Ga USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 05 September 2001 10:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Graupp     
Please Hurry, Bobbe ! I've been filing on this piece of angle aluminum for days now. I'm trying to follow the instructions but my fingers are really getting sore. I've got to play this friday night so I'll keep a close eye on here tomorrow. Where did I put that ball end I borrowed from WWBP ? (World's Worst Bass Player) He broke the third string on his borrowed bass and I know it's a big A but I'm going to file it down to fit at least I will after my fingers heal....

Regards, Paul

Jim Bob Sedgwick
Member

Posts: 1234
From: Clinton, Missouri USA
Registered: JAN 99

posted 05 September 2001 10:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Bob Sedgwick     
I totally agree with Bobbe. Bending the string does cause it to break at the apex of the changer finger. But if the string bends less, it will last longer. The more the angle of the bend, the quicker it will break. JMO BTW: The Williams changer is a big improvement, but if you leave the string on long enough, it WILL Break. Remember, Bill Rudolph calls his changer the stressless, not the stress free changer.

[This message was edited by Jim Bob Sedgwick on 05 September 2001 at 10:33 PM.]



BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 05 September 2001 10:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
It breaks exactly at the top,where it bends,Your correct in saying that the radius being sharper will break it sooner but what happens after the bend makes no differance.If it pulls at ten degrees or ninty degrees, it makes no diffrence.We now have living proof of this statment. I will get as deep into this subject as you would like if you woulu care to call me. If pulling the string at a straighter line of pull, would help,the builders would have done this many years ago. As a matter of fact, Bigsby is the worse string breaker Of all pro guitars and it has a ten degree bend over a little radius. The radius(bend) is what is killing the strings.You can do a 180 degree bend over a one inch radius and the string will last forever, (almost).
Bobbe-----Documented proof at 11;00

[This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 05 September 2001 at 10:47 PM.]



Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 06 September 2001 08:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Ed Naylor.

I like your poem's ending. If possible,
could you let me know privately, or on
this forum, if you retained copies of
"The S.G. Prayer" poem? When did you
write it, and what inspired you to be
motivated in thought sufficiently to
reflect the power through the pen?
The poem's rare spice has added an
abundance of flavor to this thread. I
am aware that you have the ability to
pass along hundreds of pertinent data,
connected with the trying circumstances
that steel guitarists face throughout
their careers; string breakage,not the
least of all. Thanks Ed, Bill H.



Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 06 September 2001 09:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Forum Members,

The issue of producing photos of the
"Lucky 7" is a matter of preparation,
and presentableness. I would enjoy
having the option to shape its simple
design, and convert the simplistic
appearance to one of unique identity.
Otherwise, there is an urgency within
me, to answer a number of requests to
place it where viewers may click on
to approve, or disapprove.

The measurements of the add-on are 1"x1"
x1/4" wide. A 1/4" piece extends down
at the outermost edge to accommodate
the string placement.
Bill H.




Ed Naylor
Member

Posts: 1827
From: portsmouth.ohio usa
Registered:

posted 06 September 2001 09:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ed Naylor     
I wrote and copyrighted this many years ago.It goes Lord I pray- That I may never- Forget to use the right knee lever- And while I'm pressing pedal B- Guide my foot past A and C.Help me remember- Whatever the key-Is it pedal up- or down- or with a knee. Give me strenght- No matter how far-To carry my Steel back to the car. And Lord may I ask as my final plea- THAT I DON'T BREAK STRING NUMBER 3. I have sold lots of these "Prayers" over the years. Ed


Pat Burns
Member

Posts: 2896
From: Branchville, N.J. USA
Registered: JAN 99

posted 06 September 2001 04:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Pat Burns     
quote:
Remember, Bill Rudolph calls his changer the stressless, not the stress free changer.

...Jim Bob, forgive me for saying so, but I fail to see the difference...would it be better to be rendered nutless, or nut free?...


slick
Member

Posts: 560
From: Calhoun Georgia
Registered: DEC 99

posted 06 September 2001 05:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for slick     
I am of the opinion that there will be no pictures.Just tryin to get it to 200!!!We are almost there.


BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 06 September 2001 05:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
Slick, never let it be said that I haven't done my part!AND my string test is over and one thing is sort of surprising, The stringwill break just about as fast tuned to a "D" as it does tuned to a F#.So it must be the bending, not the tension that is the culprit. We only tested .011 strings as this is the one most players use. Lloyd and several players will be in tomorrow to authenticate the test results. No suprises, but it should put some silly theorys to rest.
THIS IS IT! THE BIG TEST IS OVER!
Bobbe


Jerry Roller
Member

Posts: 3906
From: Van Buren, Arkansas USA
Registered: APR 99

posted 06 September 2001 05:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry Roller     
What is the subject of this lengthy discussion?
Thanks,
Jerry


BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 06 September 2001 05:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
Jerry, your parts are on the way! Sho-Bud forever!
Spinhead


Jerry Roller
Member

Posts: 3906
From: Van Buren, Arkansas USA
Registered: APR 99

posted 06 September 2001 06:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry Roller     
Hey Spinhead, what's the subject matter of this thread? Do you happen to know???
Thanks,
Jerry


Pat Burns
Member

Posts: 2896
From: Branchville, N.J. USA
Registered: JAN 99

posted 06 September 2001 06:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Pat Burns     
...subject was "how to get to 200 posts in fewer than 6 pages"...so keep it brief, guys..


BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 06 September 2001 06:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
Jerry, I don't know man, I'm really getting dizzzzzzzzzzzy! Ann Fabian has me going around in in in in in ---gee, i'm dizzzzzzy.
I wonder if she ever did this to John, I hope so, I really starting to like it!
She really has my head spinning!
Bobbe Spinhead--
(Wow, I don't even have to change my initials!--B.K.S. Or shortened, just B---never mind.)


BobbeSeymour
Member

Posts: 5664
From: Hendersonville TN USA
Registered: JAN 2001

posted 06 September 2001 06:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BobbeSeymour     
OK,Pat.Spinner


Bill Hankey
Member

Posts: 1680
From: Pittsfield, MA, USA
Registered: APR 2001

posted 06 September 2001 06:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bill Hankey     

Forum Members,

Please acknowledge my thanks for the responses on this thread. It has always been my belief that steel guitarists are very special people. Again, I wish to thank all of you for your kindness. I'm very excited about the test results. I look forward in quest of the data.

Bill H.

Jerry Roller
Member

Posts: 3906
From: Van Buren, Arkansas USA
Registered: APR 99

posted 06 September 2001 06:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jerry Roller     
Bobbe, man I am afraid you are spinning out of contol. I guess I will have to read all of it to learn what the subject is about.
Jerry


Jim Smith
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Posts: 6399
From: Plano, TX, USA
Registered:

posted 06 September 2001 07:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Smith     
Just another nudge towards 200. This one is 199, who will make the magic number?


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