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  ~ ~
  ©¿©  It don't mean a thang,   
  mm   if it ain't got that twang.
       www.ntsga.com

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Regards, Craig

Personally, I see myself as the Curator of a Museum ... Yeah

[This message was edited by Rick Aiello on 07 October 2004 at 05:26 AM.]

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What if Stevie Wonder's folks had not been able to provide him with a piano, a chromatic harmonica and music lessons when he was a kid?

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If you have a collection of instruments, give the ones you don't need away or sell them cheap. Don't be a pig. Somebody wants to play them and they should be played not collected. Collections STINK!... I know there are plenty of guitars and steels available if someone wants to buy one but not every music-loving person can afford to buy one.

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I just couldn't resist. Hey Mike, I don't need another steel, but seeing you have more than I do, would you give me one of yours?

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SUAS U' PHIOB
Geo

Guitars from The Chinery Collection

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Many of the guitars displayed here are from the more than 900 instruments in The Chinery Collection in Toms River, New Jersey. The collection was established to identify and preserve instruments that are significant to the history of the guitar in America.
The collection is shared with a wide audience to increase public understanding and appreciation of our guitar heritage. This includes access by musicians for recordings and performances, as well as study by scholars, connoisseurs, and historians. The Chinery Collection also assists guitar makers, by providing documentation of vintage guitar construction.

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Greg Simmons
Custodian of the Official Sho~Bud Pedal Steel Guitar Website

Sooo - He traveled with his regular axe and with a brand new, never been played Guild. When he saw an unknown performer, playing a POS guitar, that he felt deserved one - he gave it to them. A Tommy Smothers scholarship. Much better than smashing it on the amp, soaking it in lighter fluid and lighting it up!

I object to non-musicians who are buying up all the vintage Fenders and Gibsons and other great guitars to put in display cases, and driving up the prices to the point where working musicians can't afford them.

Another sad and crazy aspect of all this is that if you have a vintage guitar, if something goes wrong and you fix it, it becomes less valuable. I have a friend with a Leo Fender Music Man Sting Ray with Active electronics. A truly great sounding guitar. But the frets are worn down to the point where it can no longer be played. But if he has it refretted, it will lose it's value. So my friend is forced to play on an inferior guitar that doesn't have half the tone.

Maybe not by me, but I'll give it a shot.

EVERYTHING, is collectable. Ever watch "The Antiques Road Show"? I get more of a rise out of that program, than some of the after hour shows on cable. But I digress.

Do you have to be a mechanic to collect automobiles? Do you have to be an artist to collect paintings or sculpture? Do you have to be a carpenter to collect old hand tools? Do you have to be gay to collect Barbie Dolls? (not that there's anything wrong with it....). Steel guitars are no different than any other object of Americana. Whether we like it or not, that is the reality of the situation, and it is not a new revelation.

With regard to your friend's Sting Ray...what was new twenty some odd years ago is now a collectable, as well as the tool it has always been. Your friend is hardly "forced" to continue playing an unplayable guitar, unless someone is holding a musket to his head. He merely has to make a realistic value judgement, as we all do when time moves on.

First of all, if the guitar is unplayable, it certainly is worth less than if it were in mint condition. If it has great historical value, monetary value, asthetic and intrinsic value, than maybe it should be in a display case. If it's not that valuable, and it is a tool that he needs in which to make a living, then refret it so it will be good for another twenty enjoyable years with the great sound that it was intended to have. There's a certain value in that, isn't there?. Not so sad, and not so crazy.

http://hometown.aol.com/hreinlieb/page19.html

[This message was edited by HowardR on 01 February 2003 at 11:44 PM.]

The mechanics example doesn't hold water because cars are designed to be used by vast numbers of people regardless of whether or not they can work on them. They are not specialized tools with which highly skilled people create art.

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Non musicians have the right to own instruments, but do they have the right to own the BEST instruments and keep them out of the hands of musicians

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Coming from the point of view of a collector, I'll contribute a couple of "oinks" since some guys probably think I'm a pig for owning the instruments in my collection. Instruments that I play professionally, incidentally. But probably more than one player "needs."

For years I was a working musician, which means "relatively poor." I had enough coming in though to live, buy a modest home, get most of the instruments I wanted or needed to make a living. Though I might have lusted over some primo pieces, I never blamed or heaped ridicule on the guys who did own pieces of that type, regardless of what they did or didn't do with their music. They simply had resources that I didn't have.

I realized that if I was to get angry at anyone for that situation, I should start with myself for not doing whatever it took to earn the bucks to afford the instruments I fantasized over. Or deciding not to spend the bucks even though I had the money.

I call it "taking personal responsibility for my situation in life." We are all the sum total of all the choices we make in life; you made yours, I made mine.

At some point back in the mid-1980's I made another decision. I went back to school while still playing music at night and ultimately got a good job in the newspaper business which allowed me to purchase some of the stuff I wanted for years, and also to take time off to go to steel guitar shows. Things I never could do while working in bands.

I also made a decision that I wanted to get some of the instruments I'd wanted for a long time.

But to find that stuff, I had to search long and hard, constantly asking for leads, checking want ads continuously, scouring the web, asking guys if they knew of instruments available, etc. It was work, and luck, and I had a little or a lot of both. Then I had to spend the bucks.

A person in the USA has the right to own as many of anything that is legal to own as he wants or can afford to buy. To say Person X has no right to own a particular instrument... or a particular "anything"... because he's not a "deserving player" (whatever THAT means) is just, IMHO, more politically correct bullsh!t that smacks of wealth redistribution and "class-ism." It's also juvenile whining based in envy.

Some guys want garage sale prices, but they don't want to take the effort to find and go to the garage sale. Or they don't want to spend the bucks necessary, but resent those that do.

This thread, as I take it, is not about providing instruments like Carter Starters to beginners who want to learn to play; this thread is directed at collectors. These are owners of special instruments. I own special instruments that I love and play, and that, my friends, is none of anyone's business but my own.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

It was nearly 30 years ago that I saw David Lindley holding a Rickenbacher B-6, and while I loved the sound, the overwhelming reaction that I had was that I really wanted to own one ... because it looked so incredibly cool.

The same feeling washed over me the first time I saw a National tricone ... another incredible example of industrial design that I admired visually as well as musically.

But I didn't buy either one. Unfortunately, much earlier in life I had become (mistakenly?) convinced that I had no musical talent. Add to that my personal notion -- that I couldn't own musical instruments unless I was going to play them -- and I never acted on the urge to acquire either one.

Last year, not long after lecturing one of my kids (again) about not being afraid to try things for fear of failure, I went out and bought a $169 Oahu electric, and began teaching myself to play. Within a few weeks I bought a roundneck set up as an acoustic lap steel. Before long, I was buying and selling, owning a Bakelite Kiesel, a Bronson squareneck and a Superior Hawaiian acoustic.

Once I convinced myself that I could and would play a lap steel, I had the good fortune of coming into contact with Paul Warnik, and became the proud owner of a 1931 National tricone. (Make note of the fact that he's a "collector" who regularly puts fine guitars into the hands of others. I don't recall if Paul ever asked me if I was going to play it, but we talked as much about tone as we did about aesthetics. I can also attest to the fact that Mike Perlowin only wants to sell his guitars to people who will play them, and I respect his stance. ... even if I'm not sure how he and others would "enforce" it when selling.)

My wife bought me a post-war Rickenbacker "Panda" B-6 for Christmas ... so not only have my visual dreams come true, but I also get the joy of playing one or the other (sometimes both) every day I can.

Blow someone's mind! (like your own or your wife's)

All of us have had people stand and watch in amazment as we set up our steels and start to play. We often hear these people say how much they love the steel guitar and how they always wanted to have one and learn to play. Why they didn't get one and learn to play may or may not be lack of money. But if you have a steel at home that you do not use, and it is not a rare "musium" piece, try this next time someone makes that kind of comment. Tell them you have an extra steel at home that they can have for free or dirt cheap as long as they make an honest attempt to learn to play it or else give it back.

I have no problem with collections of extremly rare guitars on public display but that's not what I'm talking about at all.

[This message was edited by Don McClellan on 02 February 2003 at 11:05 AM.]

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Why they didn't get one and learn to play may or may not be lack of money.

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That is correct. It's the LACK OF DESIRE.

Anyone who has the sincere desire, the incentive, and the drive, will make the effort and obtain the instrument. Therefore, there is no reason to give a guitar to someone who WILL NOT make the effort. If they will not make the effort to obtain one, they will not make a sincere effort to play one.

There is no shortage of affordable intstruments available today, new and used. If a person cannot afford one today, they may be able to afford one in three months by working and saving. That is how I bought my first Dobro over 30 years ago. I'm proud of that and wouldn't have it any other way.

Where there's a will, there's a way (also a relative )

Don, if you are that interested in helping out "underprivilaged" musicians ... than take a que from Jimmy Carter and start a "Habitat for Humanity Type Program" and build starter steels for these folks ...

As far as my "museum" goes ...

Except for the '27 Tricone that I just bought from Paul Warnik ... EVERYONE of my 22 Rickenbachers are in MUCH BETTER condition NOW ... aesthetically and sonically ... than they were when I got them .... and they get played and enjoyed a whole lot more too ...

Last November ... with the guidance of a couple forumites ... I spent $$$ to buy the equipment and materials needed to bring back a "tool" that hadn't been made since 1941 and whose lack of availability has caused many "a good guitar" (Good not TRASHED) to be cannabilized ....

Now anyone who wants them can get 'em ... and they are every bit as good as the originals ... actually better !!!

Will I make my investment back ?? .. probably not ...

Am I enjoying being involved in this project ... BIGTIME !!!!

So, instead of starting a thread designed to chastise and belittle fellow forumites ... do something productive instead of destructive ...

Build, Finance or Organize ... talk is cheap!!!

[This message was edited by Rick Aiello on 07 October 2004 at 05:25 AM.]

I have little doubt that if guitar prices were what they used to be, many of the people on this forum would own more guitars ... and that some of today's "collectors" would sink their money into rare coins or stamps instead.

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How about all those Beanie Baby collectors out there depriving some little child of a huggable little toy?

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Yeah? Just try and take my Beanie Baby from me

explain please what a Moyle is. ROTFLMYAO

edited. a Moyle makes BIG things smaller

[This message was edited by Jody Carver on 02 February 2003 at 03:54 PM.]