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Author
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Topic: A whole new ERA for the Sho-Bud
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BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 27 October 2005 09:30 AM
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Ok Ricky-poo, I also don't want to argue with you one this forum, but I am aware of derogatory emails you have sent to several posters here behind my back. This is OK, this is a free country as one of the people that you sent me your email stated before
pointing out that it is easy to see a persons inner charictor by what he creates at the computer keyboard. I agree.
I am also aware that you idolize Shot Jackson, this is also nice, but to say he was responsible in any way for the Sho-Bud guitars from the Baldwin Crossover up is just not true. As a matter of fact, Shot told me several times that he wished David would forget the Crossover idea, of course David did, four years after starting it. The "Professional" is really just a slightly modified crossover without the cross over mechanics. (Same changer, necks, keyhead)All the following guitars from Music manufacturing were just "follow on" guitars from this "David's original design". That is until the first "Super Pro", and it was a outgrowth of David's design for Fender. Shot also had nothing to do with this series of guitars. He was busy with his own company and projects, but I did hear David say once that Shot was on the corporate board for legal reasons.
I loved Shot Jackson, knew him well for many years and am still deeply indebted to him for many favors and nice things he did for me over the years, but I spent a lot of time with David also and saw the progression of the models of these guitars from '66 to the end when I bought him out in December of 1985.
Yes, you read this correctly, I bought David's (Music City Manufacturing) complete inventory, six stories of guitars, cases, expermental projects, unbelievable amount of parts and much history of this company.
What Fred Grestch (or Baldwin) got out of the deal was only the tooling and parts to build the present production guitars. Pros and Super Pros. Of course Fred got the best deal but also paid the most money.
David retained the "right" for his father to build the lap steels, dobros, and anything he wanted to build as long as it didn't compete with the production guitars of the Baldwin Grestch Co. And for as long as he was alive. I feel David deeply loved his father, Shot and cared about his welfare and happiness, as did Harry.
I'm not to sure that Shot approved of this sale David made to Fred Grestch and Duke Cramer of Kustom Baldwin but Shot really had very little if anything to do with Music City Mfg.
So Ricky, I appreciate your love and admiration of Shot, I also have this admiration, but David Jackson deserves much more credit than he has ever gotten in the world of steel guitar.
Now David is about to share his great knowledge with us once more and I'm seeing folks that should know better call his guitar "Crap" and being derogatory about it in several ways. At least wait until you see one Ricky and John. If it is "crap", I may join you!
As far as me not being around Sho-Bud and not knowing much about it and the inner workings, this could't be farther from the truth. Not only have I been friends of David and Shot's for many years, but I lived right next to the factory on Dickerson Rd. and had many discussions with David about the design of models as they were being developed. All this along with sharing several other hobbies with him, guns, fast cars, etc.
If I haden't been playing a P-P Emmons in the mid seventies, we'd have been much better friends I'm sure! Ha! Ha!.
Anyway Ricky, let's put this bickering to rest, I'm behind you in your love for Shot and Sho-Bud. I'm also behind you in any other projects you are in to enhance the love and history of the great old legendary company.
The biggest thing of all now, lets give David a chance to see what he can do in this new world of steel guiar, I just wish we still had Paul Bigsby and Zane Beck here to do the same.
Bobbe Seymour [This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 27 October 2005 at 09:37 AM.] |
James Morehead
Member From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA
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posted 27 October 2005 11:12 AM
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I went back and reread Ricky's post on this thread. Bobbe, Could you be kind enough to point out where Ricky called David's guitars "crap"? I guess I have missed it somewhere. I'm sure it's just my ignorance. I'd like to see/hear the history of shobud guitars according to the Jackson Family. That would end this debate. |
James Morehead
Member From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA
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posted 27 October 2005 11:23 AM
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In fact, maybe I'm reading Ricky's post wrong, BUT I see Ricky actually compliment David, and the other Jacksons mentioned and wished him sucess. I wish him sucess, too. I bet Davids guitars will be fine for the newcomers as well as those who care to purchase some of the "new nostalgia"! So, my point is, let's bury the hatchet. Even the handle. |
Ricky Davis
Moderator From: Spring, Texas USA
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posted 27 October 2005 11:33 AM
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Bobbe I certainly agree with you and know many things you say are true to the bone; and I have no problem NOT bickering with you on the many many details and changes and inner workings of the Sho-bud company.
I do appreciate your acknowledgement of my Love and respect for the Late Shot Jackson. I also certainly do not want to discredit ANYTHING David Jackson has done and does; like I said, he has a great mind, no doubt.
One thing we do agree on most certainly; is what a good steel is and what a bad steel is; as you Bobbe, also have a great mind and I take a large amount of pride in learning many things from you pal.
Yes I absolutely did not say David's new steel is crap...simply because I haven't seen it and your right; we will probably both agree if it's a good one or not when we do get to see/play it.
Yes I emailed several of the guys here that seem to be very interested when you brought up the David Jackson is the designer and builder of all the sho-buds> I only thought it was neccessary to give the knowledge that I have learned from the persons I listed; in that part of the history. But you also know: "one person says this and one person says that" and bottom line is "the horses mouth" and unfortunatly; Harold "shot" Jackson is no longer with us> So I'm fine with just believing everything all those folks have said to me and believing everything you say too.....I believe it ALL my friend.
I do wish David Jackson All the luck in the world of course...as I honestly think there is something Good in every design> sure I may not like this and that; but I DO always find the parts that I do like and that IS my true character> I'm all about the "Glass half Full".
Ricky
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BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 27 October 2005 12:09 PM
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James, it was the association of Ricky's agreement with John Coop when John called the steel "Crap". The reason you can't find it now is because it was deleted by John. Hard to find things that have been deleted.
Ricky, it looks like we understand each other now, I'm very glad. I'm looking forward to to excellent business relations with you in the future and will always be more than glad to help you in our mutual quest of serving the world of steel guitar.
If I owe you any apoligies, you have them. Your friend,
Bobbe |
BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 27 October 2005 12:11 PM
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James, I just covered up the handle, feels good. We need no problems amongst us "brothers of steel guitar".
Bobbster |
Mark Fasbender
Member From: Salt Lake City,Utah
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posted 27 October 2005 12:29 PM
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Hey everyoneThis new guitar is a Jackson guitar-not a sho~bud. For all anyone knows it could be an entirely new design bearing little resembelance to a bud . All steels are similar in many respects but we all know nothing about this one. Lotsa people out there who dont wanna deal with a vintage bud or any other guitar who would rather have a low maintenance, high quality guitar. Lotsa people prefer a more "modern" sound as well. Its all good. To me,if it aint a big cabinet,it aint a bud,no matter what it says on the front of the guitar. I have the time and ability to make my buds play as good as anything out there. Lotsa people dont. If I didnt have a passion for them,I wouldnt own one, no matter how beautiful.
This new Jackson Guitar will most likely be a great instrument.given the experience of the builder. David Jackson hasnt built a sho~bud in twenty some odd years,Why would he want to start again now? I personally wouldn't expect this guitar to be a bud,rather a new guitar that will garner its own following based on its own merits.
Salutations Ricky Davis,my friend. Keepin the faith,I see. Put away the flame throwers and respect each others opinions,we'll get alot more out of this that way.
Just my opinion. I will now go into hiding.
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Got Twang ? Mark |
Mark Fasbender
Member From: Salt Lake City,Utah
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posted 27 October 2005 12:31 PM
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[This message was edited by Mark Fasbender on 27 October 2005 at 12:32 PM.] |
Nick Reed
Member From: Springfield, TN
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posted 27 October 2005 01:24 PM
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I remember specifly it was "John Coop" that said the Jackson Guitar looked like CRAP! It wasn't Ricky that said it. Nick [This message was edited by Nick Reed on 27 October 2005 at 01:25 PM.] |
BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 27 October 2005 01:35 PM
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Mark, you don't need to go into hiding, Nick, you are correct, up to a point. My apoligy to Mr. Davis should cover any problems here.
Now lets leave this alone and listen to Mark's good advice.
I'm very sure this will be a good guitar also. [This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 27 October 2005 at 01:39 PM.] |
Eric West
Member From: Portland, Oregon, USA
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posted 27 October 2005 05:14 PM
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I get so weepy when there's all this hugging going on..  EJL I miss you Bobbe. |
James Morehead
Member From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA
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posted 27 October 2005 05:19 PM
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I'm glad ya'll see through the temporary fog that happens sometimes.
And John C. DID slip on a 'nanner peel and made a "comment". Everyone has an "oops" once in awhile. So what, who hasn't? He DID delete it and try to make it right. And John's been off this thread eversince. He's probably the only one around here getting any work done!  My hats off to you John. How 'bout some more pics of my bud as you bolt on more parts? |
tbhenry
Member From: Chattanooga /USA
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posted 27 October 2005 06:53 PM
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Bobbe,When do you think this new guitar will be available? |
BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 27 October 2005 07:27 PM
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Brian, I really have no idea, but I hope soon. I know it has been in the works for a couple of years.
Wish I knew more. Let you know when I know.
Bobbe |
Farris Currie
Member From: Ona, Florida, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 08:10 AM
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REMEMBER THE SONG::::
Yes i'm going to JACKSON !!!!!!!hahahha
love it
farris |
Kevin Mincke
Member From: Farmington, MN (Twin Cities-South Metro) USA
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posted 28 October 2005 08:45 AM
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I think John Coop oughta hook up with David's passion & put his machining skills and design abilities and equipment to use on this new brand steel we've all been waiting for.... Sho~Bud!
I'll handle sales in the Midwest Region  |
BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 28 October 2005 09:57 AM
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Naw, I never owned it, got a picture of it once though.
Bobbe
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Erv Niehaus
Member From: Litchfield, MN, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 10:13 AM
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Bobbe,
I've never known you to stutter before!  |
Ken Byng
Member From: Southampton, England
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posted 28 October 2005 10:15 AM
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As Johnny Foreigner looking at everything from across the pond, why can't we all celebrate the fact that the steel guitar market has got to a point where it is considered commercially viable for new manufacturers to come onto the market place? It wasn't that long ago that people were sounding the death knell for the future of the instrument, and yet we have some outstanding people with a lot of heritage who are prepared to build modern guitars for the 2000's.Isn't it about time we all look forward instead of backwards? |
Farris Currie
Member From: Ona, Florida, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 10:51 AM
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now i'm totally confused,will i be getting a JACKSON OR A SHO-BUD it will be great what ever farris |
James Morehead
Member From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 12:06 PM
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Farris, the answer is uh-huh.
I bet if you ordered now, Farris, you could get David to inlay a mother-of-pearl possum on the front of your guitar! You'd be the only kid on your block to have one, I'll bet! |
BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 28 October 2005 01:55 PM
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Ken Byng, I agree, the future is secure! |
Farris Currie
Member From: Ona, Florida, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 02:14 PM
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James,i can't hardly wait!!!!
a JACKSON,SHO-BUD with a possum on the front,what else could a man ask for????
I bet it will be a collector item,and old Seymore would be writting about it toooooo.
mabe i can have some ball bearing for the pullers toooooo. farris |
Rick McDuffie
Member From: Smithfield, North Carolina, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 02:42 PM
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Dog, I got in too late and missed the fireworks. |
Larry Robbins
Member From: Fort Edward, New York, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 02:55 PM
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"THREADZILLA"...this one just wont die!..... |
Steve Dodson
Member From: Sparta, Tennessee, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 02:55 PM
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Naw Rick,
Just say the magic word,and the fireworks will reappear.  [This message was edited by Steve Dodson on 28 October 2005 at 02:56 PM.] [This message was edited by Steve Dodson on 28 October 2005 at 02:57 PM.] |
Larry Robbins
Member From: Fort Edward, New York, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 02:58 PM
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...See !... [This message was edited by Larry Robbins on 28 October 2005 at 02:59 PM.] |
James Morehead
Member From: Durant, Oklahoma, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 03:01 PM
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Hmmm, magic words. How about Jerry Garcia? I bet HE would have played a new Jackson guitar! |
Farris Currie
Member From: Ona, Florida, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 03:14 PM
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HA HA HA,ive heard the Jackson will be sold direct to the customer!!!ain't this grand??
Sell to the customer,leave out the middle man!!!now thats what i like!!!
We don't have to pay the JACKED UP PRICES!!! BRING IT ON DAVID, love it.
farris |
Joe Alterio
Member From: Fishers, Indiana
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posted 28 October 2005 04:33 PM
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FWIW regarding the "Sho-Bud" name (so far as pedal steels are concerned:1) Fred Gretsch owns the name. This is why the Gretsch Store sells Sho-Bud shirts and hats.....they own the right to sell them. And I asked Fred about Sho-Bud in July at the NAMM show in Indianapolis. He does own it. Period. Plus.... 2) Fred told me there is a possibility of Sho-Bud being resurrected, but gave me no specifics (e.g. timing, whether Fender or a current steel manufacturer will be building them, etc.) Again, this is direct from Fred Gretsch just months ago. Joe |
Rex Thomas
Member From: Thompson's Station, TN
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posted 28 October 2005 05:30 PM
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Seems like it boils down to "Sho-Bud WHAT?".
Seeing "Sho-Bud, Nshvl. TN" on whatever, no issue, at least not from what I notice.
However, you put "Sho-Bud Pedal Steel Guitars" on something my guess is you'll be hearing from ol' Fred.
And then again, here's this: http://www.shobudmusic.com/ (yes guys, I know it's Dawn Jackson's pub. co. dealy.)
Thought I'd toss this out.Far as the Jackson guitar goes, I'd rather put my money on one of David's guitars than a new Bud by Fender/Gretsch. There, mah!
I wouldn't do an old Bud, but if I did I'd take it straight to Duane/Jeff, no pass go, etc. From '72 when Duane set up my "Professional", that trust would remain to this day.
Am anxious to try the new Jackson.
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Duane Reese
Member From: Salt Lake County, Utah
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posted 28 October 2005 06:42 PM
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So Joe Alterio, does this mean Dawn Jackson just got a license or something to use shobudmusic.com? I said it before and I'll say it again: we'll just have to see what surfaces.And speaking of shirts and hats... You know the shirts that say "Sho~Bud pedal steel guitars"? I kind of wish they said "Sho~Bud Nashville, Tennessee" instead. Is it just me or does "pedal steel guitars" just sound a little contrived? I'm probably just thinking about this too much. |
Rex Thomas
Member From: Thompson's Station, TN
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posted 28 October 2005 07:01 PM
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It's interesting to me.
According to Bobbe's post, Gretsch bought the tooling to make "Sho-Bud Pedal Steel Guitars". Geographically (whew!), "Sho-Bud, Nshvl. TN" doesn't exist anymore. Sho-Buds were made (where, Bobbe? Arkansas? Alabama?) for many years before production stopped in '99, yes? I don't want to take that can of worms any further, but I agree, if I gotta have a Sho-Bud hat/shirt, it's "Sho-Bud, Nshvl. TN", or forget it.
I'm not an attorney, but I will say this: It makes sense that Gretsch's apparel will say "Sho-Bud Pedal Steel Guitars" but not "Sho-Bud, Nshvl. TN". Know what I mean, chili bean?
Good night Mrs. Calabash, where ever you are. |
BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 28 October 2005 07:41 PM
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The Sho-Bud name is "many a fragmented thing". Hey Rex, which Sho-Bud"? Shots? David's? Dawn's? How about mine? David's is the main one,(music City Mfg.) he sold out to Baldwin-Gretsch in Chanute KS, then Cincinatti OH., Along with Conway Arkansas, Magazine Arkansas, then Ridgland SC. Some of these manufacturing points all at the same time. All this time the money, paper work and ownership was continually changing. Shot had permission to keep his little workshop going, thanks to David's negotioations with Duke Cramer, (so David eluded to me years ago). This Sho-Bud story is a mangled mess when trying to sort out and make understandable to the masses. It seems that there have been several "Sho-Buds" in continual movement, I'll get with David someday soon and get a true path of the history of this complicated story. I sure know what questions to ask, (giggles). Just the story of how many times it moved around the city of Nashville is a story in it's self! Bobbe |
BobbeSeymour
Member From: Hendersonville TN USA
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posted 28 October 2005 07:44 PM
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There is only one living person that knows the whole story, possibly two.
I have all the questions, and a few answers, but hardly all. |
Donny Hinson
Member From: Balto., Md. U.S.A.
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posted 28 October 2005 07:52 PM
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Gee, what's next? My guess would be a reissue of the old Multi-Kord. After all, they were the first popular pedal steel! |
Duane Reese
Member From: Salt Lake County, Utah
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posted 28 October 2005 08:49 PM
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Al Terhune
Member From: Newcastle, WA
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posted 28 October 2005 11:15 PM
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I like the idea of Coop getting together with David to make the all-mighty...as much as Coop might have despised inferior engineering, I know he adored David's work. Coop might be the epitome of the Sho Bud fanatic from the era that David designed. |
Farris Currie
Member From: Ona, Florida, USA
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posted 28 October 2005 11:31 PM
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HEY DONNY,
A new MULTI-CHORD,WOW,wonder if it will be a 10stringer???
Mabe they will go with pedal rods this time,instead of cables!!!
BOYS I'M EXCITED!!!
A new MULTI-CHORD COMMING!!!!!
hahahhahaha farris |
Billy Carr
Member From: Seminary, Mississippi USA
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posted 29 October 2005 03:49 AM
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Well, all the comments about "Sho-Bud's" are interesting. I wish somebody would buy the Sho-Bud name plus everything that goes with it including all of the patterns,and other things and just start a new Sho-Bud. But anyway, I have a question for Bobbe S. I played a p/p for a long time years ago. Mine was a 66' model, I believe. I keep hearing about the fatbacks and bolt-on Emmons guitars from years ago. What exactly are these? I don't play Emmons currently but I'm still interested in there history. Not that it really matters but I'm actually a CARTER man. Still waiting on your book! Thanks in advance for any info on the fatbacks/bolt-ons. |
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